Gloomy 80s Britrock showdown: The Cure vs. The Smiths

[marqueemoon]

I do like a few of the popular Cure songs, but have not gotten very deeply into their catalog.

I was heavily into The Smiths in my 20s. Marr is a huge influence on my playing. Morrissey has always been a turd, but his antics were more tolerable before the overt racism/right wing shit, and of course Mike Joyce and Andy Rourke getting screwed is also really not cool.

[CivoLee]

Mixed feelings here- I like the Cure, and I would have said I loved the Smiths before I got to know fat, racist Morrissey better these last years. Fat Racist Morrissey sucks.

That being said, the Cure rarely have songs that are just flat out and out fun and great like "Hand In Glove", which is just a rush of excitement. The Cure are very good, but man, they can drag and drag, and for every great song there's another that's just a complete slog.

Still, both great bands that made a lot of great music, so the world is better off with both.

True, but the Smiths did have a few meandering songs in their catalog ("Reel Around the Fountain", "That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore") and the Cure had a few "fun" songs ("Hot! Hot! Hot!", "Friday I'm In Love"). That said, I agree that Cure's music can be a slog sometimes; I've come to the conclusion that "Pictures of You" is one of the most overrated alternative rock songs of all time, and after having heard various songs off Bloodflowers ("Out of This World", "Maybe Someday" and the title track), I decided to listen to the album as a whole via a YouTube playlist and it really is a drag, even if a pretty one...

[Larry Mal]

True, but the Smiths did have a few meandering songs in their catalog ("Reel Around the Fountain", "That Joke Isn't Funny Anymore") and the Cure had a few "fun" songs ("Hot! Hot! Hot!", "Friday I'm In Love"). That said, I agree that Cure's music can be a slog sometimes; I've come to the conclusion that "Pictures of You" is one of the most overrated alternative rock songs of all time, and after having heard various songs off Bloodflowers ("Out of This World", "Maybe Someday" and the title track), I decided to listen to the album as a whole via a YouTube playlist and it really is a drag, even if a pretty one...

No doubt... although I like "Reel Around the Fountain", it certainly isn't fun.

And the Cure have "High", which I just adore in every way, it's fun, and innocent, and cute and playful and, well, I just love it. There's no cynicism or sarcasm, it's just a fun song about a guy who loves a girl and he almost lost her but he learned.

[Bradley-Jazz]

I love both bands dearly, but the Cure, as a more enduring band with various phases and shifts, gives me more to dig back into.

I would propose Robert Smith and Johnny Marr as two of the Greatest Living Englishmen, really sound people with integrity and compassion, whose work means so much to me. Morrissey is clearly an utter dickhead who has tarnished the Smiths’ music for me to some extent. Marr is pretty much his opposite, and I love hearing him do the Smiths stuff - he works plenty into his live sets, and it is joyous (even the miserable ones).

However, IMO Just Like Heaven is one of the all time great pop songs.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=n3nPiBai66M

[Larry Mal]

Can't argue with that.

[s_mcsleazy]

i've tried many times getting into the smiths but morrissey's voice and politics just makes me bounce off so hard that i'm achieving orbit. i like when johnny marr covers the smiths because the dude's actually got a nice voice. but morrissey is just one of those singing voices i can't get into...... and that's saying a lot since one of my favorite albums is cough - black eyes.

the cure just seem like the overall better band to me. i've never been the biggest fan BUT i still think they got some solid albums. i even like a lot of the more pop stuff. i think people tend to underestimate how difficult it can be to write a pop song that stands the test of time, while still keeping one foot in darker genres. plus i kinda love that robert smith has always been supportive of up and coming bands.

also, can we all appreciate that robert smith gave his blessing to this cover of love song? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=op5rDyhcFio

[noisepunk]

neither would be my apex pick for gloomy 80s britrock, but given those options it's absolutely no contest: the cure.

i love a small handful of smiths songs that i think are brilliant, and think johnny marr is an incredible guitarist, but racist fat-fuck morrissey taint aside (and bless everyone for hammering that point home, because seriously, fuck morrissey), i've never been able to get through an entire album of theirs.

there are plenty of cure albums i can't get through too, but even there i usually like a song or two.

i also saw them live shortly before the pandemic, fully expecting a phoned-in bloated rock god parade, and was pleasantly floored by how good they were.

[mcbrandt]

I liked reading the story that the keyboardist wrote about ending up in the Cure and working on Disintegration (https://web.archive.org/web/20100115062 ... ories.html), but it also ruined it for me because he talked about how Robert Smith sampled a single kick drum hit and used it for every song on the album. Now that’s all I notice on songs off it. I was never a Cure fan really, so I’d have to say it’s The Smiths for me, even though I just know their hits.

[eggwheat]

The Smiths never wrote a bad song and every song they wrote was released. And it was a great call to end the band before they became crap. Morrissey’s melodies and lyrics combined with Marr’s music was just a killer combo.

‘Well I Wonder’ has always been a favourite.

The Cure should’ve taken a leaf out of The Smith’s book and ended in 1990 or so. The Cure were untouchable for 10 years..1980-1990. The Cure ended for me in 1993 after the last show at Finsbury Park that year with the classic line up. They never recovered.

But christ this music is so old now! It’s like the equivalent of us discussing frank Sinatra Vs Bing Crosby in 1986

[CivoLee]

The Smiths never wrote a bad song and every song they wrote was released. And it was a great call to end the band before they became crap. Morrissey’s melodies and lyrics combined with Marr’s music was just a killer combo.

‘Well I Wonder’ has always been a favourite.

The Cure should’ve taken a leaf out of The Smith’s book and ended in 1990 or so. The Cure were untouchable for 10 years..1980-1990. The Cure ended for me in 1993 after the last show at Finsbury Park that year with the classic line up. They never recovered.

But christ this music is so old now! It’s like the equivalent of us discussing frank Sinatra Vs Bing Crosby in 1986

The other day I saw a girl who couldn't have been any older than 15 wearing a Rolling Stones t-shirt.

It doesn't matter how old music is if it still has fans (though My Chemical Romance have probably taken what would have been the Cure's audience a decade or two earlier, at least in the US, not sure about Europe). I don't think the same could have been said about Frank Sinatra or Bing Crosby in the 80s...

[s_mcsleazy]

The other day I saw a girl who couldn't have been any older than 15 wearing a Rolling Stones t-shirt.

It doesn't matter how old music is if it still has fans (though My Chemical Romance have probably taken what would have been the Cure's audience a decade or two earlier, at least in the US, not sure about Europe). I don't think the same could have been said about Frank Sinatra or Bing Crosby in the 80s...

i'll admit when i see/hear teenagers in passing talking about MCR, it makes me feel super old because i remember seeing them either just before or around the time three cheers came out.

personally, i think it's if the music and the musicians can stay relevant after their prime years that's important. using the example you gave with MCR, if you look at what all the members have been doing since the hiatus.

frank is still repping post-hardcore/hardcore bands and is a great personality on social media
ray has been working a lot behind the scenes
gerard has had his solo stuff but still gives a few interviews and comes across as super personable.

most young people don't just want a favorite band, they want personalities in the band they can get behind to help build the parasocial relationship, nowadays most of that is on platforms like instagram and twitter.

[jakeisjake]

I've loved both since the mid 80s...

I had never heard of the Smiths and found Hatful of Hollow in a record bin in Iraklion, Crete. I was so taken by the name. But when I took it back to my room and listened to it, I'm not sure which I loved more--Marr's playing or Morrissey's melodramatic lyrics.

The Cure were one of the first bands I liked that my older brother didn't turn me on to. So...they were kinda like a coming of age thing for me. hav

Currently, I haven't enjoyed the Cure all that much and often skip them when they pop up on the shuffle; and I'm not sure why.

And when I want to listen to the Smiths, I usually just listen to Johnny Marr playing Smith songs.

[CivoLee]

One point that's definitely in the Cure's - especially Robert Smith's - favor, is how much he insists that despite their fanbase putting him on a pedestal they are very much a band, with everyone contributing to the overall sound of the group. With the Smiths, on the other hand, aside from maybe Johnny Marr, it seemed like Morrissey viewed them like his backing band.

[MechaBulletBill]

can't stand any of that eighties sadboy chorus pedal shite but at least the cure aren't cunts afaik

[burpgun]

Team Cure all the way. They evolved more, have had more interesting players (thinking of you, Simon Gallup) and at least in my opinion, had more range. I'm Gen X and both bands hit when I was a teen, and a pretty depressed one at that. The Smiths scratched a spot then I have zero interest in revisiting. I can't help associate them with juvenile teen emotions and now that I'm an old man, it just doesn't connect. Marr seems like a cool guy so I won't write the Smiths off all together, but Morrissey is and was a pretty clownish guy, of the sort that degrades a band's legacy. That said, if the Cure had hung it up after Wish, I can't say that would have been a bad outcome.