selectable greasebucket/regular tone control on a push pull pot?

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redielg
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selectable greasebucket/regular tone control on a push pull pot?

Post by redielg » Sun Mar 26, 2023 6:56 pm

What's up,

I'm in the middle of acquiring all the parts for my upgrade/mods project of my CVJM. For electronics, I've got a 6-way freeway switch for series and out phase tones. i'm really excited for that. but, I've also got two CTS push pull pots for volume and tone. I plan to use those to select between stock and treble bleed volume control and a stock and greasebucket tone control. Freeway has wiring diagrams for a 6 way switch and i have found a wiring diagram for a treble bleed on a push pull pot. however, I haven't found diagram for a greasebucket tone control on a push pull pot (understandably).

I'm wondering if its even possible to wire a tone control to switch between both. I assume it is, I'm just now sure how to exactly wire that up. Could I get any help on learning how to wire that up? or a diagram? I have a little soldering experience form modding my jazz bass and gretsch, but I'd greatly appreciate any help. I'll show off the final product once/if I pull it off.

I realize its a pretty niche thing to do. however, having tried both treble bleeds and a greasebucket tone on other guitars i rather like those sounds but i think it'd be neat to be able to switch between stock and modded volume and tone. again, any help would be awesome.

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Embenny
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Re: selectable greasebucket/regular tone control on a push pull pot?

Post by Embenny » Sun Mar 26, 2023 7:50 pm

There are three points where the greasebucket circuit differs from a regular tone pot - a resistor in series with the main cap, and a small cap wired across two lugs of the pot.

That means that you'd need three poles on the switch switch (TPDT) instead of two (DPDT). I'm not aware of any push-pull pot with that kind of switch attached.
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bodhi
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Re: selectable greasebucket/regular tone control on a push pull pot?

Post by bodhi » Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:12 am

Searching for how the greasebucket control is wired, I came across this:

Image

It essentially bypasses the bass cut part of the greasebucket, while leaving the other parts intact. The difference to a regular tone control is then that the 0 position cannot be reached, and the 0.02 microfarad cap may or may not be your ideal choice for your guitar. Though a quick look elsewhere online suggests that these have been wired up with other value capacitors as well, so probably best to experiment to see if it's useful for you.
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redielg
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Re: selectable greasebucket/regular tone control on a push pull pot?

Post by redielg » Mon Mar 27, 2023 3:37 pm

Embenny wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2023 7:50 pm
There are three points where the greasebucket circuit differs from a regular tone pot - a resistor in series with the main cap, and a small cap wired across two lugs of the pot.

That means that you'd need three poles on the switch switch (TPDT) instead of two (DPDT). I'm not aware of any push-pull pot with that kind of switch attached.
Okay, awesome. this is what i needed to know. If it was even possible.

So, the only way to implement my idea would be to get a 3PDT toggle switch on conjunction with a regular potentiometer for tone? maybe with a slider 3PDT switch. eh. i don't think its worth the hassle. I'll pick one or the other for a tone control. thanks for the info. I really appreciate it. I'll post my guitar when i'm done.
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redielg
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Re: selectable greasebucket/regular tone control on a push pull pot?

Post by redielg » Mon Mar 27, 2023 3:50 pm

bodhi wrote:
Mon Mar 27, 2023 10:12 am
Searching for how the greasebucket control is wired, I came across this:

Image

It essentially bypasses the bass cut part of the greasebucket, while leaving the other parts intact. The difference to a regular tone control is then that the 0 position cannot be reached, and the 0.02 microfarad cap may or may not be your ideal choice for your guitar. Though a quick look elsewhere online suggests that these have been wired up with other value capacitors as well, so probably best to experiment to see if it's useful for you.
oh neat, so its kind of possible. If what I've read about grease bucket tone is correct, with this diagram. I'll never reach "0" on the tone control because the resistor is still on the circuit right? this diagram is only bypassing the bass cap like you say. I would just have to translate that DPDT switch to the holes push pull pot, right? i think that's an acceptable compromise.
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Re: selectable greasebucket/regular tone control on a push pull pot?

Post by bodhi » Tue Mar 28, 2023 10:59 am

redielg wrote:
Mon Mar 27, 2023 3:50 pm

[...]

oh neat, so its kind of possible. If what I've read about grease bucket tone is correct, with this diagram. I'll never reach "0" on the tone control because the resistor is still on the circuit right? this diagram is only bypassing the bass cap like you say. I would just have to translate that DPDT switch to the holes push pull pot, right? i think that's an acceptable compromise.
I believe the resistor should block the 0 position, but I wonder if the wiring would have some other effect as well... Not 100% sure. Another idea would be to use a stacked pot with a push pull to isolate the circuits completely, since you could wire the regular tone pot on one set of pot lugs and the greasebucket on the other. Those kind of pots aren't all that common, but do exist, at the very least if you search Arrow or Mouser or some of the other large suppliers.

In any case, I'd imagine that you'd settle for either or at the end after testing out the wiring and the newness wore off, but it's good to experiment and the parts are cheap.

The DPDT switch lugs are functionally the same as whatever push pull pot you have, some are stacked identically to the drawing, but if you have CTS pots or something like that you need to check the wiring. A multimeter is always a surefire way to figure out how something works, but not strictly speaking necessary.
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