12 string project

[Shadoweclipse13]

I was looking for the Kluson Revolution F style tuners but it doesn't seem like they ever made one with a lefty footprint.

Unless it's a custom order thing, I don't believe they ever did. Welcome to the frustrating world of needing lefty-correct parts and the frequent lack of options.

[rbrcbr]

I was looking for the Kluson Revolution F style tuners but it doesn't seem like they ever made one with a lefty footprint.

Unless it's a custom order thing, I don't believe they ever did. Welcome to the frustrating world of needing lefty-correct parts and the frequent lack of options.

The struggle is real. I'll have to keep looking I suppose. Bummer that this thing was stripped of tuners to begin with, you'd think people know how hard they are to come by, but I guess since it's been modified it pays more to part it out.

[solfege]

Man, that adds a new wrinkle to the vintage vs. modern F-tuner nightmare. I had to buy vintage ones for my RH late 70s Musicmaster neck b/c of the collar they added at the base of the post in all new production F-turners, even those supposed to fit 'vintage' necks (they do not). If you haven't already, you might want to verify that whatever you've got will work with the drilling of the 'right hand' side before advancing too far in any direction.

In any event, that neck is a super-rare bird. I wouldn't mess with it and would say buy the vintage tuners if it hasn't already been redrilled for something else.

An alternate option, which might end up being cheaper and easier (though not faster) is to get a XII neck from Musikraft, put whatever new production tuners you want onto it, and also have it properly drilled for them, with the bonus that it'll fit the neck pocket of your existing body. OFC, you might need to be sure that this option would work with the spacing on whatever bridge you end up using.

In any event, if you stay with the vintage neck and (given the relative value and rarity of the various bits you're working with in that instance) is to accommodate everything else to the needs of keeping the neck unmolested. Another argument for doing that, btw, is that the extra wide vintage XII necks supposedly play better than the narrower spacing forced onto you by a modern one. I'm only reporting that, however. Not based on my own experience.

[ETA: Oh wait, I just read that the neck has been modified already. Forgot that. Some of the above may not matter in that case.]

[rbrcbr]

Man, that adds a new wrinkle to the vintage vs. modern F-tuner nightmare. I had to buy vintage ones for my RH late 70s Musicmaster neck b/c of the collar they added at the base of the post in all new production F-turners, even those supposed to fit 'vintage' necks (they do not). If you haven't already, you might want to verify that whatever you've got will work with the drilling of the 'right hand' side before advancing too far in any direction.

In any event, that neck is a super-rare bird. I wouldn't mess with it and would say buy the vintage tuners if it hasn't already been redrilled for something else.

An alternate option, which might end up being cheaper and easier (though not faster) is to get a XII neck from Musikraft, put whatever new production tuners you want onto it, and also have it properly drilled for them, with the bonus that it'll fit the neck pocket of your existing body. OFC, you might need to be sure that this option would work with the spacing on whatever bridge you end up using.

In any event, if you stay with the vintage neck and (given the relative value and rarity of the various bits you're working with in that instance) is to accommodate everything else to the needs of keeping the neck unmolested. Another argument for doing that, btw, is that the extra wide vintage XII necks supposedly play better than the narrower spacing forced onto you by a modern one. I'm only reporting that, however. Not based on my own experience.

[ETA: Oh wait, I just read that the neck has been modified already. Forgot that. Some of the above may not matter in that case.]

Yeah, check out the photo on the first page if you haven't already - the hockey stick was chopped at some point and made into some sort of symmetrical spear point. Kind of endearing, kind of gross too. I'm tempted to try and restore it by grafting a new piece of wood and then matching the headstock, but it might not be worth the effort in this case. I guess we'll see what happens once it's all strung up and together.

I'm leaning towards just grabbing two sets of modern Klusons and drilling new holes for them. I just can't afford to shell out $500+ on tuners alone at this point.

Here's a question for anyone interested - would swapping the rhythm circuit with something like a series/parallel switch to make the middle position humbucking be worth doing? I'm still trying to figure out a wiring scheme. At the moment I'm leaning towards a kurt switch for the 3 way and an on/off for the middle pickup...now that I think of it perhaps I can make the on/off on the kurt switch a series/parallel switch and then dedicate the rhythm circuit to an on/off middle pickup with dedicated tone and volume control?

[solfege]

Makes sense, honestly, re: tuners. Vintage f-tuners are a nightmare, and modern ones don't retrofit properly. What I would do is figure out what will work with the existing post-holes if at all possible, then have at it.

Re: humbucking middle position. That’s not determined by series / parallel alone. Pickup magnet orientation and wind direction is also in play. Be sure you have an rwrp set to achieve the humbucking middle position. Series / parallel will basically give you two different tonalities. Agree it's super hard to see the point of a 50k tone-pot rhythm circuit on a 12-string.

If you wanted to really have fun, it's kind of cool to imagine getting a pickguard made with the 3-way toggle moved to the upper bout like the Modern Player JMs but then having two slide switches where the roller knobs are for series/parallel *and* a phase switch (you'd only need to switch the phase of one pickup), b/c why the hell not. I feel like that'd maximize the range of possible middle position jangliness, while also not having the toggle on the lower bout where your thigh hits it all the time while seated / crouching down.

[rbrcbr]

Makes sense, honestly, re: tuners. Vintage f-tuners are a nightmare, and modern ones don't retrofit properly. What I would do is figure out what will work with the existing post-holes if at all possible, then have at it.

Re: humbucking middle position. That’s not determined by series / parallel alone. Pickup magnet orientation and wind direction is also in play. Be sure you have an rwrp set to achieve the humbucking middle position. Series / parallel will basically give you two different tonalities. Agree it's super hard to see the point of a 50k tone-pot rhythm circuit on a 12-string.

If you wanted to really have fun, it's kind of cool to imagine getting a pickguard made with the 3-way toggle moved to the upper bout like the Modern Player JMs but then having two slide switches where the roller knobs are for series/parallel *and* a phase switch (you'd only need to switch the phase of one pickup), b/c why the hell not. I feel like that'd maximize the range of possible middle position jangliness, while also not having the toggle on the lower bout where your thigh hits it all the time while seated / crouching down.

Looks like the klusons that came with the other neck fit the post holes, only issue is I don't have any bushings to confirm that spec.

And thanks for the info regarding series/parallel needing RWRP pickups - it hadn't occurred to me. I'm not sure of how to confirm what these are in terms of winding/orientation but they seem to just be stock AV65/Pure Vintage jaguar pickups.

The switching layout you're talking about could be cool, I could potentially drill out the rhythm circuit plate for a 3 way and go from there. We'll see - I haven't had time lately to work on this between trying to acclimate our new kitten at home and work/friends visiting from out of town. Might have to wait til September to dig in lol.

[solfege]

The AV/PV '65s are RWRP and so hum cancelling in the middle. I have a set, and I'm fairly sure it's in the documentation somewhere.

[Britfingersisback]

You could put grover 103c tuners on, they are reissues of the ones fender used on some custom order 60 and 70s. They are available in both left and right hand

[N0_Camping4U]

What's the update

[Britfingersisback]

You could put grover 103c tuners on, they are reissues of the ones fender used on some custom order 60 and 70s. They are available in both left and right hand

Was just about to say that myself. They look great and was also on some coronado models

[rbrcbr]

You could put grover 103c tuners on, they are reissues of the ones fender used on some custom order 60 and 70s. They are available in both left and right hand

Ah man, I thought about it but I figure it would be too neck heavy with 12 of those on it. Might feel a little more cluttered as well.

What's the update

Been absolutely fuckin slammed working 6 days a week for the past two months, no time at all for this. Basically wherever we last left off

[jonathanelyashiv]

Hey! I'm not sure this will help you in your search for lefty F style tuners but the fender villager XII's have those tuners and those guitars can be cheapish. You could always get a beater one, swap the tuners and sell it off with repro tuners

[rbrcbr]

After an insane christmas season, a short vacation, and general NYC insanity, I'm hoping to get the ball rolling on this project soon. Fingers crossed for an update in the next couple weeks

[rbrcbr]

Finally stuck around after work and banged out some stuff for this:

Had to make a template and work with a chisel and a mini dremel (nail tool) and got the neck to fit the pocket - I worked at it with a sanding block a while ago and made some progress but it was taking forever. This photo with the template was taken after taking out a good bit of neck pocket wood





Got in there with the awl and drilled some holes for the pickguard screws, also had to widen the neck route in the guard, kind of botched it but whatever, it fits now



Also had to hit the middle and bridge pickup routes with a chisel and open up the pickup routes in the guard to make sure the pickups fit:





Not the cleanest work but it'll be functional enough for now. Not too shabby for a first time with a chisel I guess. Just need to order the rest of the parts and install everything, wire it up, and then see if the damn thing will intonate

[Nudger]

Did you get this finished?