'weak' high e. help!

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JamesSGBrown
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'weak' high e. help!

Post by JamesSGBrown » Mon Jul 26, 2021 5:28 am

Hi all,

My Jag build has gone great... but I've noticed the high e seems to ring out weaker than the rest of the strings. I have:

Changed strings
Increased headstock break angle with a deeper-set string tree
Swapped the bridge
Checked it's clearing the bridge saddle's screw
Messed with pickup height

...all to no avail. It's not obviously choking or anything, but it's got a good I'd say 20% less volume and sustain than all the other strings both when fretted and open (which leads me to believe it's not the nut, right?)

So, what could it possibly be? It's the one thing stopping it from being a perfect guitar for me, and I am stumped!

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GreenKnee
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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by GreenKnee » Mon Jul 26, 2021 6:02 am

Is the string particularly close to a pickup? Could the magnetic pull of the pickup be killing the vibrations of that string?

What new bridge have you fitted? I had a similar thing with the original style offset bridge when the string was sat over the grub screw hole rather than in its own thread/groove.

I'm not sure what else could cause it. Is it only when plugged in, or can you hear it when unplugged too?

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sal paradise
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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by sal paradise » Mon Jul 26, 2021 6:23 am

Probably the wrong tone wood
I have nothing to offer anybody, except my own confusion?

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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by JamesSGBrown » Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:46 am

GreenKnee wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 6:02 am
Is the string particularly close to a pickup? Could the magnetic pull of the pickup be killing the vibrations of that string?

What new bridge have you fitted? I had a similar thing with the original style offset bridge when the string was sat over the grub screw hole rather than in its own thread/groove.

I'm not sure what else could cause it. Is it only when plugged in, or can you hear it when unplugged too?
It's a staytrem- tried 2 and the issue is still prevalent.
When unplugged also!
I'm thinking maybe it could be the nut, but am not qualified to know how much of a difference that would even make when fretted?

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JamesSGBrown
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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by JamesSGBrown » Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:46 am

sal paradise wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 6:23 am
Probably the wrong tone wood
Please elaborate...

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garyfanclub
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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by garyfanclub » Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:58 am

JamesSGBrown wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:46 am
sal paradise wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 6:23 am
Probably the wrong tone wood
Please elaborate...
He's being facetious...

Sounds like you're on the right track; have you tried raising the action and ruling out that the string is choking out on one of the frets? Sounds like it could be a high fret issue.

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GreenKnee
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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by GreenKnee » Mon Jul 26, 2021 8:27 am

JamesSGBrown wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 7:46 am
GreenKnee wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 6:02 am
Is the string particularly close to a pickup? Could the magnetic pull of the pickup be killing the vibrations of that string?

What new bridge have you fitted? I had a similar thing with the original style offset bridge when the string was sat over the grub screw hole rather than in its own thread/groove.

I'm not sure what else could cause it. Is it only when plugged in, or can you hear it when unplugged too?
It's a staytrem- tried 2 and the issue is still prevalent.
When unplugged also!
I'm thinking maybe it could be the nut, but am not qualified to know how much of a difference that would even make when fretted?
Is the string clearing the edges of the bridge without touching anything? Even if it looks like it's pretty much clear, if the string touches when vibrating this would kill the sound somewhat

Image

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GreenKnee
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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by GreenKnee » Mon Jul 26, 2021 8:51 am

Some pics of my Staytrem showing string distance from the edges for reference, hope it helps.

Low E side:

Image

High E side:

Image

Plent of room for a pick between the strings and bridge:

Image

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j mascis
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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by j mascis » Mon Jul 26, 2021 11:37 am

Also look at the nut and listen to the nut - does it sound muted at all or like a sitar?

Agree with pickup height and checking if it's hitting frets, too.

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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by DeathJag » Mon Jul 26, 2021 12:56 pm

I would love for my hi E and B strings to be weak. The reverb makes them “scream like banshee!”* I may pad up the bridge to intentionally have your problem!

What else can be done to deaden those two strings? I have to play just those strings softly to sound even, it’s a drag. (Instro surf so it’s all leads.)

Dan

* Huge 80s horror movie buff points if anyone can place that phrase!

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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by GreenKnee » Mon Jul 26, 2021 1:30 pm

DeathJag wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 12:56 pm
I would love for my hi E and B strings to be weak. The reverb makes them “scream like banshee!”* I may pad up the bridge to intentionally have your problem!

What else can be done to deaden those two strings? I have to play just those strings softly to sound even, it’s a drag. (Instro surf so it’s all leads.)

Dan

* Huge 80s horror movie buff points if anyone can place that phrase!
A bit of a hand-rolled cigarette paper under the strings should do the trick, a folded piece for more of the effect. Have you tried knocking the tone control down just a tiny bit? I find this tames any shrillness without muddying up the rest of the sound

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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by jorri » Mon Jul 26, 2021 4:57 pm

GreenKnee wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 1:30 pm
DeathJag wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 12:56 pm
I would love for my hi E and B strings to be weak. The reverb makes them “scream like banshee!”* I may pad up the bridge to intentionally have your problem!

What else can be done to deaden those two strings? I have to play just those strings softly to sound even, it’s a drag. (Instro surf so it’s all leads.)

Dan

* Huge 80s horror movie buff points if anyone can place that phrase!
A bit of a hand-rolled cigarette paper under the strings should do the trick, a folded piece for more of the effect. Have you tried knocking the tone control down just a tiny bit? I find this tames any shrillness without muddying up the rest of the sound
I knew someone who tip-exed on their pole pieces once. But paper seems alright, bowed string bridge do that. I find graphiting the nut takes a bit off open strings.


...but more seriously, what can be explained by pickup height adjustment? I notice maybe the treble side isnt closer to the strings? What strings are being used? Sometimes its a dud or can be solved by a string change. Sometimes i notice the E being weak since it is not massive or perhaps dependant on the EQ of what its run through.... Thinking the notes around there could be 'scooping mids' frequencies or 'rolled off treble'.

Well what else? Mustang saddles are kind of imperfect, maybe something is muting at the connection.

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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by DeathJag » Mon Jul 26, 2021 5:40 pm

GreenKnee wrote:
Mon Jul 26, 2021 1:30 pm
A bit of a hand-rolled cigarette paper under the strings should do the trick, a folded piece for more of the effect. Have you tried knocking the tone control down just a tiny bit? I find this tames any shrillness without muddying up the rest of the sound
I tried the tone knob thing, it either is too subtle or it makes the low strings muddy. I love the idea of just putting thin cardstock at the saddles! I have tried switching to custom pickups, messing with heights, many EQ pedals, but I never thought to try a free remedy! I’ve also thought about tapping down the pole pieces but I’m too scared it’ll break em. Thanks!

Dan

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JamesSGBrown
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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by JamesSGBrown » Mon Jul 26, 2021 11:13 pm

There's definitely clearance between the string and both sides of the saddle (not enough to fit a pick under mind).

HOWEVER. I did notice, upon Over-the-top vibrato usage, the high e 'pings' by the bridge. Not every time I go back and forth, like every 6th-7th time.

Could these issues be related?

The shit mystery continues.

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Re: 'weak' high e. help!

Post by alexpigment » Tue Jul 27, 2021 4:44 pm

Is it possible your bridge is angled? I know you said it's a Jag build, and perhaps the holes for the bridge weren't drilled perfectly perpendicular to the neck. On the other hand, an angled neck (or neck pocket) could do the same, and that's not an uncommon thing when mixing parts.

Lastly, before you spend any serious amounts of money, perhaps try a different brand of strings. Strings are not all equal, and certain guitars can exacerbate this more than others.

And lastly lastly, pics couldn't hurt. A few shots of the bridge and a shot of the fretboard where it meets the body.

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