OffsetGuitars.com

mbene085 wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 06, 2021 1:04 pm

You have to add glue under the plates?

That takes this unit off my list of parts I've wanted to try. I also change tunings often enough that I've missed the lock button every time I've gone without it.

I guess I just have to wait for the AmPro II units to hit the aftermarket if I want to try something other than the AVRI.

This is a great unit, really. But it is something to have in mind. It has been mentionned here before I think.
I also own a mastery one which is as great and do not need such maintenance. Nor the original offset vibrato and some of its improved versions.
Descendant remains on top of the list with the Mastery. Both great units.
I will try the Halon one later this week. I will put it on my custom shop 59 JM.

Sorry I misread. The loctite is adviced for the mounting screws.

Can you explain the 'glue under the plates' comment? Doesn't really make sense, only some type of epoxy would stick to stainless steel. And what is being stuck together?

Sorry I misread. The loctite is adviced for the mounting screws.
You can find here a detailed installation guide :
https://www.homeoftone.co.uk/blogs/news ... nt-vibrato

OK, so not 'glue' at all.

Suggestion from the manufacturer to apply a small amount of grease or anti-seize to the arm is sensible - assuming all parts are stainless steel (and no dedicated bearing or sleeve is involved) galling is a possibility as the arm swings back and forth in the collet.

Yes sorry in my mind loctite = super glue 3
but they have many other products.

I don't know anything from loctite that's not glue ^_^U What exact product are you talking about?

molul wrote: ↑

Thu Jan 07, 2021 8:03 am

I don't know anything from loctite that's not glue ^_^U What exact product are you talking about?

Their array of thread-locking compounds. It even says 'threadlock' in the linked article.

https://www.henkel-adhesives.com/au/en/ ... ckers.html

222/Low strength would be the most suitable application for those small fasteners:
https://www.henkel-adhesives.com/au/en/ ... e_222.html

Though you can easily get away with 243/Medium, provided it's applied sparingly. IME this is more commonly available whereas 222 can be difficult to find off the shelf:
https://www.henkel-adhesives.com/au/en/ ... e_243.html

When someone just says 'loctite', they invariably mean threadlocker (or at least they should). In recent years Loctite do also sell CA/superglue, so if you go to the hardware store and just grab something that says loctite on the pack/bottle, you can be misled. This is not what you want ...


Blue/242 has always been the go-to loctite for me.
https://www.loctiteproducts.com/en/prod ... ue242.html

Oh, thank you very much for the clarification. Now this makes sense. Everytime I read people applying "glue" to the bridge sounded so weird to me lol

molul wrote: ↑

Thu Jan 07, 2021 10:04 pm

Oh, thank you very much for the clarification. Now this makes sense. Everytime I read people applying "glue" to the bridge sounded so weird to me lol

me too !

Hey, This is Chris Swope. Forgive me for neglecting this site. I logged on today for the first time in ages to take a quick look at something completely unrelated to the Descendant and saw this thread. Like many of us, I'm stretched very thin for time. I'm a one man operation trying to build guitars and vibratos in a small shop in my basement while, during the pandemic, my wife and two kids are upstairs zooming all day long with jobs and remote learning. As a result, I'm woefullly behind on putting detailed info on my website. What I most need to do is create a frequently asked questions page. I know that would help everyone, myself most of all.

On the subject of loctite, yes, thread lock and specifically the blue thread lock. Don't ever use the permanant stuff (red or green or whatever else is out there) unless you are prepared to heat things up to approximatley 450 degrees fahrenheit when you need to unscrew something. The blue is plenty sufficiant for this application.

What you need to know about me is that I'm often overly cautious. Once you have everything set up to your liking I would advise that a drop of thread lock on each of the four screws that clamp down the fulcrum plate is the best way to insure that the fulcrum plate stays fixed without needing any further tightening down the road, regardless of the frequency and intensity of use. I believe this is the best practice but it is also something, from a manufacturing standpoint, that needs to be said for warranty concerns. People have asked me directly, "do I really have to add the loctite?" and the honest answer is, "No." As long as you keep the adjustment wrench in your case so that if you find there is a little play in the unit you can tighten it up on the spot.

The same over-caution is the reason behind the recent white lithium grease suggestion that James' Home of Tone so kindly took and then made a video about, which someone posted just a few comments prior to mine. I've just recently starting applying a tiny bit inside the arm housing of each unit during assembly and I love the way it makes the arm movement feel. I know maintenance doesnt' come naturally to many when it comes to guitars but we do change strings. Many of us seasonally adjust our truss rods. The sort of maintenace I'm suggesting is minor and is meant to insure that your vibrato functions with optimal performance for years and years and years.
And more years.

Thanks

Thanks for your message and happy new year, Chris!

Please don't justify yourself for being absent. You have a great product and I'm sure it will be really successful during the following years among the offset community. It's only a matter of time that you can get more people to help you make more units and hopefully more variations (here's hoping for a black version)

Keep up the good work!

Guitaronimo wrote: ↑

Fri Jan 08, 2021 6:37 am

Hey, This is Chris Swope. Forgive me for neglecting this site. I logged on today for the first time in ages to take a quick look at something completely
And more years.

Thanks

Thanks, Chris. I just wanted to say that it really does look like a great product and I'm looking forward to getting one some day.

Okay, where's the "like" button. Seriously, I have no idea how to navigate this forum. Thanks for the kind words.

augur wrote: ↑

Wed Jan 06, 2021 3:14 am

I did receive a Descendant vibrato a few days ago for my new project of Jazzmaster (will send more pictures soon).
I love the look of the holes (teeths) and it feels very sturdy made !

Did you (as previous customer) receive email from Swope guitars regarding recommended maintenance however ?
He recommends to put grease on arm in order to avoid "galling". It seems he had some complains for a few users.
This and the fact you have to add glue under the plates, it looks a bit weird actually.

EDIT: Sorry I misread. The loctite is adviced for the mounting screws.

Did anybody have any (small) problem with Descendant vibrato in the past ?


I have also ordered and received a Halon vibrato and bridge (it is much cheaper for me as I live in Europe)
in order to upgrade a Fender CS 59 JM by the way. The quality looks also very high.

What's the Halon vibrato like? I'm going to order a Jazzmaster bridge to fit my adjusto-matic equipped Fender Thurston Moore Jazzmaster. But the vibrato is of interest to me. I have a Mastery vibrato on another guitar, so what is the difference between the units?