Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

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hchoe741
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Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by hchoe741 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:10 am

I'm new to JMs, at least one with a trem, and I always assumed the lock button completely locks the trem: no moving up, or down. That's not the case, obviously.

My question/idea: the disk that slides in between the top plate, and the trem, Make that longer, and add a groove/slot, so the trem COMPLETELY locks down.

Possible?

Here is a crude mockup
https://drive.google.com/file/d/18DBIyL ... p=drivesdk

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Axolotl
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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by Axolotl » Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:27 am

I mused about this a few times. It would be much more useful this way IMHO.
I wouldn't be surprised if some fellow forumites attempted at something like this already. Looking forward to read more about this.

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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by hchoe741 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:28 am

If someone produces something like this for sale I would jump on it. Doesn't seem like it would be too complicated for a machinist.

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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by Larry Mal » Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:51 am

I might be missing something, but why? What is the advantage here to simply not using the tremolo unit and possibly removing the arm?

As it is, the tremolo locks in a very specific way in order that the guitar will stay in tune should a string break, so that's the only function there, and that's why it doesn't lock both ways. The point is that you can use it with limited functionality but with the safeguard in place should a string break, and hopefully it doesn't go out of tune.

But I really don't like that kind of tremolo unit or really use tremolo at all, so for years, I just pulled the arm from the unit.
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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by hchoe741 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:57 am

Larry Mal wrote:
Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:51 am
I might be missing something, but why? What is the advantage here to simply not using the tremolo unit and possibly removing the arm?

As it is, the tremolo locks in a very specific way in order that the guitar will stay in tune should a string break, so that's the only function there, and that's why it doesn't lock both ways. The point is that you can use it with limited functionality but with the safeguard in place should a string break, and hopefully it doesn't go out of tune.

But I really don't like that kind of tremolo unit or really use tremolo at all, so for years, I just pulled the arm from the unit.
It could come in handy in recording situations when you need the tuning rock solid. Especially if bending strings a lot.

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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by JSett » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:17 am

hchoe741 wrote:
Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:57 am
Larry Mal wrote:
Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:51 am
I might be missing something, but why? What is the advantage here to simply not using the tremolo unit and possibly removing the arm?

As it is, the tremolo locks in a very specific way in order that the guitar will stay in tune should a string break, so that's the only function there, and that's why it doesn't lock both ways. The point is that you can use it with limited functionality but with the safeguard in place should a string break, and hopefully it doesn't go out of tune.

But I really don't like that kind of tremolo unit or really use tremolo at all, so for years, I just pulled the arm from the unit.
It could come in handy in recording situations when you need the tuning rock solid. Especially if bending strings a lot.
If set up correctly, bending strings and tuning won't be affected by the vibrato being 'active' any more than a hardtail guitar.
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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by echoplex » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:19 am

Patent pending





..... just kiddin

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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by JSett » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:23 am

echoplex wrote:
Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:19 am
Patent pending





..... just kiddin
Just make sure you patent using the word 'vibrato' and not 'trem' :fp: :-X
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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by Axolotl » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:24 am

Larry Mal wrote:
Fri Jan 27, 2023 8:51 am
I might be missing something, but why? What is the advantage here to simply not using the tremolo unit and possibly removing the arm?
Well, if the tremolo was locked completely, I think the guitar will feel and sound more like a true -top loader- hardtail. It can make a bit of a difference if you bend notes, especially if you bend one while letting another ring. With or without the arm, bending against the tremolo's springs makes the other stings to go slightly flat and requires a bit more of effort (the same happens on a Strat I reckon). Nothing bothersome as is the nature of the instrument. But I do note the difference in this matter when playing on a Tele or DuoSonic vs an Offset. I can certainly bend to a higher pitch considerable less effort. I wouldn't mind such a feature on a JM trem. I'd probably use it quite a bit.

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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by Axolotl » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:25 am

(deleted for double posting)
Last edited by Axolotl on Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Embenny
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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by Embenny » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:28 am

johnnysomersett wrote:
Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:17 am
If set up correctly, bending strings and tuning won't be affected by the vibrato being 'active' any more than a hardtail guitar.
Yeah, I've never had an issue with that. I thought Strats suffer from that problem because the springs of the vibrato run parallel to the strings - increasing string tension pulls directly on them, so they give a little and all the strings drop in tension and pitch.

The JM vibrato's spring is perpendicular to the strings, and increasing string tension with a bend doesn't seem to generate enough force in that plane to compress it. Or at least, not on my guitars.
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hchoe741
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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by hchoe741 » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:33 am

johnnysomersett wrote:
Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:23 am
echoplex wrote:
Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:19 am
Patent pending





..... just kiddin
Just make sure you patent using the word 'vibrato' and not 'trem' :fp: :-X
And 'screw' on neck, not 'bolt' on

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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by marqueemoon » Fri Jan 27, 2023 9:39 am

The JM vibrato lock isn’t the greatest design, but it’s really a non-problem.

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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by BatUtilityBelt » Fri Jan 27, 2023 1:23 pm

If it's about optimal tuning, tight tolerances would be very important, and I think that would be your big challenge for an aftermarket mod.

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Re: Idea - A trem lock that FULLY locks

Post by jorri » Sat Jan 28, 2023 4:28 am

I think its been discussed somewhere on here before. A V shape could plausibly overcome some tolerances- {ask an actual engineer here} - but a sandwich of the current shape would be difficult. You could add a bolt for adjustment but that is complex, just to be able to set it to fit without a gap

I don't find tuning an issue, except with upbends on the trem, and i generally like being able to downbend only anyway, so to me the lock is good left on always. Thumping against the button can be annoying (shall i cover it in felt?) but you don't tend to pick that up amplified.

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