Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

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Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by TheAugusteVibrato » Tue Aug 18, 2020 12:15 am

Hi there, new member (just made a post on the introductions board awhile ago).

TLDR: Are any aftermarket Mustang vibrato units by the likes of All Parts, Scud, Montreaux, etc. better than a standard MIJ Mustang vibrato?


I've got an early 2010s MIJ Mustang (MG73 CO) which I've had for a few years and recently got the bug to try to get the vibrato (or tremolo or trem or whatever you want to call it) working "properly."

I went and cut my own new bone nut from scratch, which came out better than any of the factory nuts on any of my other guitars; I put on .011 gauge strings; and literally lubed up every friction point with a Planet Waves Lubrikit (Nut Sauce knockoff) *except* for the bridge and saddles because the strings aren't supposed to slide over those by design.

For all my troubles, if I use the vibrato the exact same way every time, the strings basically come back in tune (some will be spot on, two or three will be within a couple of cents according to a BOSS TU-3 tuner).

But the thing is, it seems like there are several "balancing" points for the vibrato unit instead of just one it always returns to. If I use it and it's out of tune, I can bump it around a bit, with all of the strings more or less all going equally sharp, flat, or in tune depending on which point the vibrato settles back into. Is this just how Mustangs are, even the original USA-made ones?

Based on Internet searches, it seems most agree the MIJ Mustang vibrato units are made with metal that isn't strong enough for the job, and which may not even be sharpened to a knife edge in the first place (I actually haven't checked that on mine yet, despite having disassembled the unit when I lubed all the parts up - oops!).

So, are any of the aftermarket vibrato units you can find for sale any better? I'm here in Japan, and as far as I can tell, there are three "decent" (as in they don't look like fly by night operations) guitar parts brands selling aftermarket Mustang vibratos: All Parts (which of course is well-known), Scud (which appears to be managed by Hosco, which you may have heard of if you ever shopped for nut files), and Montreaux (and I'm not really sure about how good this brand is). There are also the usual assortment of random cheap Chinese Mustang vibratos which are sold under various brand names and which are probably all made in the same factory.

Are any of those aftermarket vibrato units stronger/better made/stay in tuner better than the standard units the MIJ reissues come with?

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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by TheAugusteVibrato » Sat Aug 22, 2020 11:41 pm

So nobody on here has any experience with aftermarket Mustang vibratos in comparison with the ones that come standard on MIJ reissues? :mellow:

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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by NICQ » Sun Aug 23, 2020 12:00 am

I tried one of those cheap chinese knockoffs from ebay : http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/vie ... 9#p1632619

I have to admit for 12$ it's ok with light trem use - too much bending and it does not return to pitch perfectly.. but I only notice it when checking with a tuner, fine for my ears..

I think I went for the middle spring notch.. ? You can adjust the tension by that if I remember correctly?
Last edited by NICQ on Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by ChrisDesign » Sun Aug 23, 2020 6:44 am

Fender well replacements for the Japanese tremolo, but they’re currently out of stock: https://shop.fender.com/en-GB/parts/bri ... 9000.html
Just try some cheep Chinese ones and see what happens.
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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by TheAugusteVibrato » Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:52 am

I mean, I'm already getting "satisfactory" results with the default vibrato. I was just wondering if anyone had experience with both (original MIJ Mustang reissue vibrato and aftermarket) and if any aftermarket ones were noticeable improvements.

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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by TheAugusteVibrato » Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:54 am

NICQ wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 12:00 am
I tried one of those cheap chinese knockoffs from ebay : http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/vie ... 9#p1632619

I have to admit for 12$ it's ok with light trem use - too much bending and it does not return to pitch perfectly.. but I only notice it when checking with a tuner, fine for my ears..
Thanks for sharing! Sounds about like what I'm getting already.

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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by Debaser » Wed Aug 26, 2020 7:08 am

I don't think anything out there is any better or worse. The problem, besides the wraparound strings on the hotdog bar, is that the plate is also the fulcrum 'knife' point. This point wears out, some quicker than others. I've had good success with the original VM Mustang plate, but that eventually became unusable/unstable. I tried MIJ, same thing. I bought a mid 60s vintage unit, and it was ok, but not that much better.

The only improvement to be had is the new Performer series Mustangs. Fender uses a hardened, thicker steel bar below the mounting plate. I don't own one, but this is the reason if I wanted a Dynamic Vibrato again, I'd only go with that model.
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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by TheAugusteVibrato » Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:10 am

Debaser wrote:
Wed Aug 26, 2020 7:08 am
I don't think anything out there is any better or worse. The problem, besides the wraparound strings on the hotdog bar, is that the plate is also the fulcrum 'knife' point. This point wears out, some quicker than others. I've had good success with the original VM Mustang plate, but that eventually became unusable/unstable. I tried MIJ, same thing. I bought a mid 60s vintage unit, and it was ok, but not that much better.

The only improvement to be had is the new Performer series Mustangs. Fender uses a hardened, thicker steel bar below the mounting plate. I don't own one, but this is the reason if I wanted a Dynamic Vibrato again, I'd only go with that model.
Finally, someone who's tried a few different ones! Thank you for your thoughts.

I love the guitar, so if worse comes worst, I'll just replace the vibrato unit with a new one or lock it down. At any rate, I'm just not a vibrato/trem user but since I have the guitar and it's designed to float, I thought I'd give it the old college try to get it working properly. Right now, at least, tuning is stable just playing normally and the vibrato can be used and come back into tune for small warbles about as well as a standard strat, so I'm happy.

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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by Debaser » Thu Aug 27, 2020 7:30 am

TheAugusteVibrato wrote:
Thu Aug 27, 2020 4:10 am
Debaser wrote:
Wed Aug 26, 2020 7:08 am
I don't think anything out there is any better or worse. The problem, besides the wraparound strings on the hotdog bar, is that the plate is also the fulcrum 'knife' point. This point wears out, some quicker than others. I've had good success with the original VM Mustang plate, but that eventually became unusable/unstable. I tried MIJ, same thing. I bought a mid 60s vintage unit, and it was ok, but not that much better.

The only improvement to be had is the new Performer series Mustangs. Fender uses a hardened, thicker steel bar below the mounting plate. I don't own one, but this is the reason if I wanted a Dynamic Vibrato again, I'd only go with that model.
Finally, someone who's tried a few different ones! Thank you for your thoughts.

I love the guitar, so if worse comes worst, I'll just replace the vibrato unit with a new one or lock it down. At any rate, I'm just not a vibrato/trem user but since I have the guitar and it's designed to float, I thought I'd give it the old college try to get it working properly. Right now, at least, tuning is stable just playing normally and the vibrato can be used and come back into tune for small warbles about as well as a standard strat, so I'm happy.
The Mustang vibrato is a bit underrated, IMHO. There's a wide range to it--I was able to get it to nearly slacken strings at one point like those floyd shred deals. I eventually hard tailed mine because even the basic warble/shimmer stuff was knocking it out of tune. It's not like I didn't know what I was doing, I've owned about two dozen guitars with all models of Bigsby, Floating Trems, a Strat or two, G&L two-point, and Les Trems. The nut and bridge are the usual culprits, except there are a couple more things to deal with on the Mustang..
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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by andy_tchp » Thu Aug 27, 2020 9:40 pm

Best results I ever got were to crank the cigar tube down as low as it'll go (so no up-bending possible) and put the springs on the notches that provide the highest tension. I could dive-bomb and it'd return to pitch near perfectly.

This was on a MG65 Fender Japan reissue.
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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by kurski » Sun May 22, 2022 3:16 pm

Few years have gone by and I can tell you from owning both CV Mustang and latest MIM Jagstang the only differences between them are: engraving, radius and thread size for the trem arm grub screw: Metric/Imperial.

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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by jonnyrocket » Wed Feb 15, 2023 10:03 am

I have extensively looked at this and ended up getting the Vibrator from a Performer series Mustang. It requires some routing to the body for it to fit in a Cobain Mustang and on a Squier Mustang. So far I have only used it for several weeks and already can confirm it is more stable than the japanese version on the Cobain mustang as well as the one that came on the squire.

This vibrato has such a huge range and it is finicky to set it up correctly. I am still ironing out some kinks on it but it is getting closer and closer. I want to be able to move it both ways and would like for it to return to perfect tuning regardless of wether I pull or push the vibrato.

Many moving pieces have to be set up perfectly well for this to work. Nut perfectly filed and lubed, bridge and cigar and string gauge also must all be in balance. I still don't have it down perfectly well but it is getting there!

If anyone knows a surefire way to set this up, please let me know!

cheers,
Jon

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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by JSett » Wed Feb 15, 2023 10:19 am

I never found a Mustang unit that was good with tuning stability...from vintage up until present day. It's just not a very good vibrato system unfortunately
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Re: Are any of the aftermarket Mustang trem/vibrato units better than the ones that come on MIJ reissues?

Post by jonnyrocket » Wed Feb 15, 2023 10:58 am

johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Feb 15, 2023 10:19 am
I never found a Mustang unit that was good with tuning stability...from vintage up until present day. It's just not a very good vibrato system unfortunately
Have you tried the vibrato from the Performer series Mustang? It has a plate that reinforces it so the knife-edge should not wear out as fast as on the traditional Mustang vibratos. This plate is the reason the guitar needs to be routed so that it can fit.

This vibrato so far is considerably more finicky to set up right compared to a Strat and a Jazzmaster in my experience. I have read that other people have been able to set it up in a way that the guitar stays in tune but it seems to me that a great deal of reaching this comes down to trial and error.

I have been able to get both the AVRI vibrato as well as a Wudtone strat vibrato to return to perfect tuning even after heavy use! What is frustrating is that in these two vibratos, it's fairly easy to set it up properly. The Mustang vibrato is more finicky and frustrating.

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