Rotten Relics

Discussion of newer designs, copies and reissue offset-waist instruments.
Post Reply
User avatar
kuel
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 5:36 am
Location: sydney

Relic Finishes

Post by kuel » Sat Aug 18, 2007 2:07 pm

Whats the general consensus on relic finishes?

I'm genuinely annoyed at my telecaster, its got a high gloss black finish, and having self-diagnosed OCD, I can't help polishing the damn thing every 5 minutes.
I toyed with the idea of relic-ing it, it does bother me as being quite 'fake' but on the other hand i dont intend to sell it ever as a relic, only for personal enjoyment.
Everyone loves vintage, right? laugh
http://relicdeluxe.com/body_guitar_lacquer_finish.asp
http://www.stevesguitarsite.com/RELIC%20PART%202.html

Other options I thought of;

- Sanding the gloss finish down to a dull-matte (kinda like a nitro-esque) finish using 2000-3000grit sandpaper, followed by a polishing compound of some sort?
http://www.nymphusa.com/tele/relic_strat_std_e1.asp

- Stripping it with a heatgun and repainting it trans-black or nitro

User avatar
jetset
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1528
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:45 pm
Location: Baltimore
Contact:

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by jetset » Sat Aug 18, 2007 4:40 pm

I'm not a fan of faked relic finishes - even the best look fake to me.  Just tour with the guitar for a year with no case - it'll relic pretty quick on it's own.
-J
I can't hear the forest for all the falling trees.

User avatar
StevenO
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 17768
Joined: Wed Oct 18, 2006 7:06 pm

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by StevenO » Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:04 pm

I like light relics but not the super scratches up guitars that have come to fruition in the past few years by people who put together partsmasters and tear them apart and then sell them for lots of money. A few people here know my stance on those guitars, heh, heh...  ::) :(

I just don't like it when it's overdone because it's usually done wrong as well, and you always end up thinking "how would a normal guitar get these type of dings/arm wear?" So I'd prefer a guitar that is just a bit worn in.

User avatar
RumorsOFsurF
Mods
Mods
Posts: 17598
Joined: Tue Jan 30, 2007 6:55 pm
Location: Oregon

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by RumorsOFsurF » Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:41 pm

Just play the thing!  Don't worry about polishing it, especially if it's poly.  I am strongly against damaging a guitar's finish just to make it look "vintage."  It seems counter-productive. 

My ten year old black MIM Tele still looks pretty much brand new, except for a big ding I put in it somehow.  I haven't polished it in 5 years probably.
Damn kids, get off my lawn!

User avatar
Surfoverb
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2007 6:37 am
Location: Commonwealth

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by Surfoverb » Sat Aug 18, 2007 5:49 pm

I dont like them at all. I can dig the argument that reliced necks feel better/smoother/faster but thats as far as I would even consider relicing anything. It seems so dishonest. I couldnt look everyone that sees my guitar in the eye everytime they ask about it and have to tell them, "No its not 40 years old, it is made to look that way" It just seems so cheesey, but thats just me. I saw a guy playing a relicd nocaster in GC and I was stoked at first and asked, "Is that a real 51 nocaster?" Of course the answer was "no its reliced"...I felt ripped off.

User avatar
dain
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 847
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2007 8:28 am
Location: hollywood, USA

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by dain » Sat Aug 18, 2007 6:10 pm

i just cannot form a relationship with a shiny new guitar.  i had a 79 rickenbacker 12 string with all the case candy in mint shape and i used it to record one tiny sound on one song in the entire 5 years i had it.  i was terrified to take it out of the case because i knew if it even got ONE nick it would be my fault.  it wasn't a tool it was a museum piece!

the relicd 64 jag i just bought has never left my sight because i can feel free to drop it on the floor next to me when i'm watching TV or hang out in the garden with it.  its been on almost 60 or 70 songs so far.  THAT is a useful tool!

these things are working tools, and anything you can do to make yourself feel cooler or more comfortable USING your tools is for the best.

of course i also have a floor length mirror in my studio so i guess you shouldn't take it TOO far.

thanks for the links!

User avatar
sonik
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 616
Joined: Thu Jul 12, 2007 10:51 am
Location: houston, tx
Contact:

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by sonik » Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:27 pm

I'm with Dain on this, whatever makes you comfortable with your instrument.  I've never tried relicing and probably wouldn't buy one, but I understand how a perfectly shiny finish can make a guitar feel like it isn't really yours yet.

Maybe you should just strip it and  refinish it in thin nitro, and it will probably "relic" on its own pretty quickly.  I've never owned a factory-nitro instrument, but I refinished a Musicmaster bass with the reranch nitro.  I'm not much of a perfectionist, so after a few coats, I figured I was done and started playing it again.  In a month, that thing looked pretty reliced!
Last edited by sonik on Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
dain
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 847
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2007 8:28 am
Location: hollywood, USA

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by dain » Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:37 pm

that said, i do think the fender relics are a little funny looking... the only way a bridge could rust like those is if aquaman was playing it every night at the walrus party...

User avatar
jetset
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1528
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:45 pm
Location: Baltimore
Contact:

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by jetset » Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:46 pm

That's it, my next band will be "walrus party"
-J
I can't hear the forest for all the falling trees.

User avatar
PorkyPrimeCut
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 24464
Joined: Tue Nov 28, 2006 7:46 am
Location: Leipzig
Contact:

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Mon Aug 20, 2007 4:50 pm

Scuse the big picture........

I got my '59 Jazzmaster refinned & the guy asked if I wanted it "reliced". At the time I knew little about the subject & simply said that it'd be nice if it didn't look brand-spanking new but I didn't want it looking too fucked up as I paid good money for the job.

He did the freezer treatment on the nitro. At first I wasn't sure about it but I love it now.
Plus I've since seen guitars with the original finish since that look the same as mine.

Even the way the cracks spider out. Not all old paint jobs crack in horizontal lines.

Going at it with a file & sandpaper to get "arm wear" would be silly.

I just like the character you get when it has that cracked laquer look. Also if it gets a ding it gets a ding. I'm not gonna wrap it in cotton wool.

This guitars mine for life.

Image
You think you can't, you wish you could, I know you can, I wish you would. Slip inside this house as you pass by.

User avatar
Surfoverb
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1360
Joined: Sun Apr 15, 2007 6:37 am
Location: Commonwealth

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by Surfoverb » Mon Aug 20, 2007 6:14 pm

Ive got some natural checking on my Jag neck and I think it looks badass. The best part was that UPS did it no charge.  ::)

User avatar
kuel
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 55
Joined: Tue Aug 14, 2007 5:36 am
Location: sydney

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by kuel » Mon Aug 20, 2007 6:15 pm

Surfoverb wrote: Ive got some natural checking on my Jag neck and I think it looks badass. The best part was that UPS did it no charge.  ::)
HAHAHHAHAHAHHAHAA  ;D

glimmertwin
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 3371
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 11:21 am
Location: Austin, TX

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by glimmertwin » Mon Aug 20, 2007 8:15 pm

I think a good relic job is a great thing - I'm the same way about a brand new guitar.  If it looks too new it aint coming home with me because I'll just feel like the brute who effed up a new guitar.  The thing is, I think most amateur relic folks take it too far.  It's tempting to go all the way, but I gotta say if you use thin nitro and lightly age the metal parts, you'll have a pretty authentic looking one pretty quick that is mostly natural.  That's my new attitude to my own projects at least...

If anyone is interested in a relic tip, here is a good one I got from the Stew Mac email newsletters(everyone should sign up for them - even if you only get one useful tip, it's free!).  I wish I had a link to the actual page - I just have the email as Stew Mac doesn't appear to archive these but it had a visual picture of what these tuners looked like and it was very impressive relic job on metal.  The task was to age some new replacement tuners on a real 57 Les Paul Jr.  Holler at me if you want the actual email and I can send it to you. 
From a Stew-Mac Tips and Tricks newsletter:
"This guitar’s tuner knobs were rotting right off the posts. Dan Erlewine and I looked it over, and saw two options: replace the plastic tuner knobs, or install a new set of tuners. The knobs-only approach is the truest to vintage, but such old tuners often aren’t working well anyway. That’s when a new set is needed.

We decided to do both options to show Trade Secrets readers. Dan’s knob replacement story ran a few weeks ago. Here’s Plan B: installing a new set without losing the vintage looks.

I started with a set of vintage-style tuners with the same shape and embossing as the originals. They’d fit right in on a cleaner guitar, but I wanted these to look old and nasty! The trick is something I saw online recently at the Les Paul Forum, and it’s available at Radio Shack: etchant solution for printed circuit boards. This fluid contains ferric chloride, which eats into metal surfaces.

Before using the etchant, I scuff-sanded the tuners with an 1800-grit Micro Mesh finishing pad to distress the plating a bit. I didn't go crazy with it, just enough to knock off a little shine and give the solution something to bite into. Then I was ready for the etchant.

The etchant is corrosive, so don’t mess around: wear gloves and eye protection, and work in a well-ventilated place. It also works fast, so it’s a good idea to test this on some scrap hardware first. You can control its working time by diluting it with water. I used 3 parts etchant to 1 part water. This did a nice job of dulling the tuner plating. A stronger mix will give a stronger effect. I gave it a light touch — I wanted it to look like something from the 1950s, not from the Lord of the Rings.

I applied the etchant with a Q-tip, and the process happened quickly — be ready to move fast. Once you get the look you want, give the tuners a good rinsing in water to stop the etching. Most modern vintage-style tuners are packed with lubrication which will protect the gears. I simply dried these with a paper towel, then used a can of compressed air to blow out any water.

The knobs still needed to be aged. I tried stains, tea, and coffee to yellow them, but wasn’t happy with the results until I tried good ol’ brown Kiwi shoe polish. I rubbed it into the knobs with a soft cloth, and let dry for 20 minutes. Then I took off the excess polish with a clean paper towel, and they looked great!

Dan came up with a great suggestion for adding some more age: taping off the tuner knobs and spatter-painting the exposed metal with shellac mixed with a little ColorTone vintage amber stain.

This shellac-speckling was the icing on the cake; it gives ’em the genuine honkytonk look, don’t you think?

To thoroughly clean up this vintage Junior, we removed all the hardware, even the grommets around the tuners. (Be careful if you try that — it’s really easy to chip the finish!) With Q-tips and elbow grease, all the dirt came off, and we used no-silicone polish to get it looking like 1957 again!
"I enjoy the current state of offsetguitars hostility."

User avatar
chrisjedijane
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 3322
Joined: Sun Sep 17, 2006 8:32 pm
Location: Belfast, Northern Ireland
Contact:

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by chrisjedijane » Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:59 am

I really like relic finishes - I don't think I could ever really play a vintage guitar as I'm pretty hard on my guitars, but the relics come pretty close to approximating the feel of a nicely worn-in guitar. Also, gig it hard for a couple of months and you'll start to add your own scratches :D
"we lack the motion to move to the new beat"

User avatar
mynameisjonas
Admin
Admin
Posts: 12695
Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2006 5:55 am
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Contact:

Re: Relic Finishes

Post by mynameisjonas » Tue Aug 21, 2007 3:23 am

it depends on how believable the relicing is. i've seen some really nice looking relics, and some really terrible looking ones.

if i were you i would go with the nitro refin, and then just have the guitar laying around on the floor, or leaned against a wall or whatever. play it a lot and the wear will start showing pretty soon.

Post Reply