The Synth Thread...

All instruments that aren't guitars (or bass guitars).
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eggwheat
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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by eggwheat » Tue May 24, 2022 2:28 am

Whoosh.

Anyway…the new Oberheim looks incredible I have to say. I would have liked to see more of the Xpander style modulation matrix in it. My ideal synth is the OB 4/8 voice tone with the control feature of the Matrix/Xpander.. and this looks like it comes quite close to that.

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wooderson
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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by wooderson » Wed May 25, 2022 12:19 pm

eggwheat wrote:
Tue May 24, 2022 2:28 am
Whoosh.
What part didn't I get it? The OP-1 Field is expensive, perhaps 'overpriced' or 'bad value' but it's not a 'joke' and explaining how you can replicate it in software remains silly. You can make that argument about every synth and sampler so all hardware must be pointless and dumb by extension.

If the OP-1 was so easily replicated, we'd probably see a bunch of competitors debut over the last decade - but thus far the number of battery powered super-portable synth/sampler/sequencer/recorders remains... 1. The closest competitor (Dirtywave M8) just debuted and the second-closest competitor (MPC Live II) is many times larger.

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by eggwheat » Sun Jun 12, 2022 12:05 pm

Sorry missed this. I meant it went over my head. Michael who did the vid is no fool..(he's a great guy too). Many people agree with him as do many disagree. I had the original when it came out...sold within 6 months or something. The practicality and fucntionality of the OP is in my opinion poor.. but if you like it more power to you. I think no-one copies it because it's a niche product thats not particularly good.

The fact remains...what you can do with laptop and free software today is absolutely incredible. And today's laptops are so powerful and light just compared to a few years ago. Just worth thinking about before you blow 2k.

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by tade » Sun Jun 12, 2022 11:49 pm

I've never tried an OP and never really felt interested on it but I have a couple of friends who swear by it and they're not exactly new comers to the synth game, so I assume there has to be something to it.
Asking almost double for the new version shows a great confidence in the product at the very least.

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by wooderson » Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:48 am

eggwheat wrote:
Sun Jun 12, 2022 12:05 pm
Sorry missed this. I meant it went over my head. Michael who did the vid is no fool..(he's a great guy too). Many people agree with him as do many disagree.
It's not about agreeing or disagreeing with him, though - you absolutely do not need hardware to make music (aside from, you know, a guitar if you're so inclined). Plugins are amazing.

Arguing that you don't need hardware because plugins exist, though, is just a different kind of Youtuber hot take (as Bill Hicks put it, the "anti-marketing dollar, that's a big market"). With a laptop, you at minimum need a MIDI keyboard - those two pieces alone make the laptop 'solution' many times larger than an OP-1, which fits in your pocket and runs for a full day on battery.

One is not a replacement for the other.

If portability doesn't matter, then all of the tiny little synths (Organelle, OP-1, Dirtywave, et al.) are a bad value, because the miniaturization is a large part of the point. But that just means it's not a product for you, not that they're bad products.

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by eggwheat » Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:40 pm

wooderson wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 11:48 am
eggwheat wrote:
Sun Jun 12, 2022 12:05 pm
Sorry missed this. I meant it went over my head. Michael who did the vid is no fool..(he's a great guy too). Many people agree with him as do many disagree.
It's not about agreeing or disagreeing with him, though - you absolutely do not need hardware to make music (aside from, you know, a guitar if you're so inclined). Plugins are amazing.

Arguing that you don't need hardware because plugins exist, though, is just a different kind of Youtuber hot take (as Bill Hicks put it, the "anti-marketing dollar, that's a big market"). With a laptop, you at minimum need a MIDI keyboard - those two pieces alone make the laptop 'solution' many times larger than an OP-1, which fits in your pocket and runs for a full day on battery.

One is not a replacement for the other.

If portability doesn't matter, then all of the tiny little synths (Organelle, OP-1, Dirtywave, et al.) are a bad value, because the miniaturization is a large part of the point. But that just means it's not a product for you, not that they're bad products.
You don't need a midi keyboard. You can use the keyboard keys of the laptop(did you not watch the video?), the OP keys are hardly like a midi keyboard by any stretch anyway. The screen real estate is obviously vastly inferior on the OP versus a laptop screen etc. I understand we all have preferences, but Mike's video is by no means dumb and is worth watching and considering.

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by wooderson » Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:47 pm

eggwheat wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:40 pm
You don't need a midi keyboard. You can use the keyboard keys of the laptop(did you not watch the video?), the OP keys are hardly like a midi keyboard by any stretch anyway.
There's a wild difference between two octaves of keys (shaped vaguely like keys) and QWERTY note entry. At that point you might as well run with "you don't need a keyboard, you can just draw in all the MIDI."
The screen real estate is obviously vastly inferior on the OP versus a laptop screen etc. I understand we all have preferences, but Mike's video is by no means dumb and is worth watching and considering.
It's clickbait, just taking a different route compared to oohing and ahhing over the latest piece of gear.

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by mediocreplayer » Mon Jun 13, 2022 5:14 pm

wooderson wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:47 pm
eggwheat wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:40 pm
You don't need a midi keyboard. You can use the keyboard keys of the laptop(did you not watch the video?), the OP keys are hardly like a midi keyboard by any stretch anyway.
There's a wild difference between two octaves of keys (shaped vaguely like keys) and QWERTY note entry. At that point you might as well run with "you don't need a keyboard, you can just draw in all the MIDI."
The screen real estate is obviously vastly inferior on the OP versus a laptop screen etc. I understand we all have preferences, but Mike's video is by no means dumb and is worth watching and considering.
It's clickbait, just taking a different route compared to oohing and ahhing over the latest piece of gear.
I think I agree with your general sentiment but it is obvious you have never made music on an iPad. There is literally not a single thing that the OP-1 can do that the iPad cannot do infinitely better. Infinitely. Including playing velocity sensitive "keys" with aftertouch. Bringing in keys as an argument in favor of the OP-1 is a bit desperate to be honest. There is no problem in liking whatever it is that we like, but no reason to bend over backwards to justify it.

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by wooderson » Mon Jun 13, 2022 6:48 pm

mediocreplayer wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 5:14 pm
I think I agree with your general sentiment but it is obvious you have never made music on an iPad. There is literally not a single thing that the OP-1 can do that the iPad cannot do infinitely better. Infinitely. Including playing velocity sensitive "keys" with aftertouch. Bringing in keys as an argument in favor of the OP-1 is a bit desperate to be honest. There is no problem in liking whatever it is that we like, but no reason to bend over backwards to justify it.
I don't have any interest the OP-1, though (no need for portability here) - I just find the "you can do X instead" argument completely ignores the importance of how you interact with the thing you're making music on. How many posts are there on the main offset forum here about fret sizes and radii and neck thickness? Physical interaction matters. QWERTY doesn't replace keys.

I actually have an iPad Pro sitting on my desk (that cost more than a used OP-1 - to read comics and draw, music is a bonus). Borderlands, Samplr, Animoog Z, Patterning 2, etc.. lots of interesting apps that are optimized for a touch interface.

The options for recording are much more of a PITA than a four-track recorder ala OP-1 - hope your apps are AUV3 compliant or hope your host does IAA, iOS file management sucks, no headphone out, if you want to get audio in or out (if you'd like to hook it up to your mixer or interface as a sound source with other gear, for instance) you really need a class compliant interface. I use an extra MOTU M2 as an intermediary to make it a sound source for other gear if I want to record anything from it.

The value of the OP-1 is in the portability and in the way all of that is streamlined as a system. If those things don't matter to you, then there's no point in getting one (they don't matter to me, no commute here and it would be a cold day in hell that I'd stop on a hike to jam) - but that doesn't mean there's no value, or that the OP-1 is a joke/ripoff/etc..

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by eggwheat » Thu Jun 16, 2022 3:52 am

wooderson wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:47 pm
eggwheat wrote:
Mon Jun 13, 2022 2:40 pm
You don't need a midi keyboard. You can use the keyboard keys of the laptop(did you not watch the video?), the OP keys are hardly like a midi keyboard by any stretch anyway.
There's a wild difference between two octaves of keys (shaped vaguely like keys) and QWERTY note entry. At that point you might as well run with "you don't need a keyboard, you can just draw in all the MIDI."
The screen real estate is obviously vastly inferior on the OP versus a laptop screen etc. I understand we all have preferences, but Mike's video is by no means dumb and is worth watching and considering.
It's clickbait, just taking a different route compared to oohing and ahhing over the latest piece of gear.
I dont agree with anything you've said. So let's agree to disagree ;)

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by Maggieo » Thu Jun 16, 2022 9:52 am

I've had my OP-1 since they first came out, and it's fun. I keep it on my dresser and usually plonk around on it before I go to bed.

The 4-track recorder still flummoxes me, after all these years.
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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by alvinstraight » Wed Jul 06, 2022 11:40 pm

Had to drive a few hours with short notice to pick this one up, but am glad I did!

Image

Image

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by eggwheat » Thu Jul 07, 2022 2:27 am

alvinstraight wrote:
Wed Jul 06, 2022 11:40 pm
Had to drive a few hours with short notice to pick this one up, but am glad I did!
A lovely CS60..probably my favourite sounding synth. Is the ribbon working? Ive had to replace quite a few on these.

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by alvinstraight » Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:29 am

eggwheat wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 2:27 am
alvinstraight wrote:
Wed Jul 06, 2022 11:40 pm
Had to drive a few hours with short notice to pick this one up, but am glad I did!
A lovely CS60..probably my favourite sounding synth. Is the ribbon working? Ive had to replace quite a few on these.

Yeah, pretty amazing instrument this. Most everything seems to be working, including the ribbon. Carried it over to my tech (with some help, he only lives 500m away) to have it looked over, but I think I was lucky and found one that seems in pretty good shape. Have you experienced any other issue with yours?

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Re: The Synth Thread...

Post by eggwheat » Sun Jul 10, 2022 11:16 am

alvinstraight wrote:
Fri Jul 08, 2022 2:29 am
eggwheat wrote:
Thu Jul 07, 2022 2:27 am
alvinstraight wrote:
Wed Jul 06, 2022 11:40 pm
Had to drive a few hours with short notice to pick this one up, but am glad I did!
A lovely CS60..probably my favourite sounding synth. Is the ribbon working? Ive had to replace quite a few on these.

Yeah, pretty amazing instrument this. Most everything seems to be working, including the ribbon. Carried it over to my tech (with some help, he only lives 500m away) to have it looked over, but I think I was lucky and found one that seems in pretty good shape. Have you experienced any other issue with yours?
Hi, I dont own one myself but I fix and restore a lot of vintage synths for various vintage gear dealers like Soundgas etc. So I get to play with all different synths and gear. I also own a ton of stuff myself :fp: .

Main issues are just general service work, rebuilding power supply, re-capping the entire machine. Doing a full factory calibration which can be time consuming...Cleaning keyboard contacts. Common to find the ribbon not working as its spring that simply corrodes and breaks in places...some completely disintegrate into mulitple pieces. It's very expensive to replace and fiddly to get right when you do. Also the CS50/60/70/80 are loaded with custom Yamaha IC's which do break..and are unobtainable today..and extremely scarse and difficult to source secondhand. I often get asked to fit Kenton MIDI kits to them too. I restored a CS70m recently...thats was also fantastic sounding, though not similar to the CS60/80.

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