help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Get that song on tape! Errr... disk?
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panoramic
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help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by panoramic » Mon Apr 04, 2022 4:52 am

As the topic says, I use to do a lot of recordings back in the days of 2005-2014 but alas I got married, had a kid and a massive priority changeover.
I got divorced a while back and have been getting way back into writing an wanted to set myself up with a micro studio situation in the bedroom at my apt.

Here's the stuff I still have from before:
Mbox interface @2011 (probably not very useful nowadays)
sm57, sm58, 2 sennheiser 906's and 1 609, lots of mic cables
an alto branded mixer
some art tube preamp i used on vox from 2005-1012 for breakup
a tascam dp-008 from 2011 or 2012. I used this to record the track sand I would mix them down in logic or gband. For a while i recorded directly into Logic with a presonus interface as well but i often deferred to the easiest way possible (lazy)

I need to upgrade interfaces and computer for sure but any little ideas you have would be awesome to read up on.
I'll also need to either get something to DI through for guitar like a preamp or a smaller wattage amp maybe an ac4-12 thing.
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by UlricvonCatalyst » Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:28 am

Behringer U-Phoria UMC202HD

I bought one of these just as lockdown began - cheap and cheerful, with great bang to buck ratio.

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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by panoramic » Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:30 am

UlricvonCatalyst wrote:
Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:28 am
Behringer U-Phoria UMC202HD

I bought one of these just as lockdown began - cheap and cheerful, with great bang to buck ratio.
I'd been looking at these for a while and the arturia one looks good too. I'm glad to read a positive review of the Behringer unit :D as that pricepoint is SOLID
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by Larry Mal » Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:40 am

Can you tell us a little more about how you plan to record? I was going to point out the need for room treatment, since even the best equipment in the world isn't going to do much for you if you use it in a bad sounding environment.

But you might just be recording directly to the computer, in which case you don't need that.

What is your imagined workflow?
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by øøøøøøø » Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:49 am

It’s much cheaper and easier to build a small recording setup now than when you were last in the game.

Lots of companies offer little 2-in, 2-out interfaces that will outperform your old mBox, usually for around 100-200 bucks.

Really, there’s not much harm in just picking one and getting to work.

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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by panoramic » Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:55 am

Larry Mal wrote:
Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:40 am
Can you tell us a little more about how you plan to record? I was going to point out the need for room treatment, since even the best equipment in the world isn't going to do much for you if you use it in a bad sounding environment.

But you might just be recording directly to the computer, in which case you don't need that.

What is your imagined workflow?
I'm not going to need much in the way of soundproofing. My plan is to use a very low wattage amp in any scenario where i am actually mic'ing and probably a pre-amp pedal thing in front of any guitar stuff I DI. When I had a house i did all of the treatments and such, set up some rooms for certain uses etc but I am not even thinking on that level right now. The end goal here is to record some of the songs I've been writing and send them off to friends of mine to add their parts to so we can piecemeal a record together. I will probably be recording guitars/vox for the most part with some backing drumbeat throwaway track i use as a metronome.
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by panoramic » Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:56 am

øøøøøøø wrote:
Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:49 am
It’s much cheaper and easier to build a small recording setup now than when you were last in the game.

Lots of companies offer little 2-in, 2-out interfaces that will outperform your old mBox, usually for around 100-200 bucks.

Really, there’s not much harm in just picking one and getting to work.
like the focusrite scarlet? People always recommend that one it seems.
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by Larry Mal » Mon Apr 04, 2022 6:03 am

panoramic wrote:
Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:56 am


like the focusrite scarlet? People always recommend that one it seems.
Scarletts are good. I would probably say that at their price point they are the industry standard at this point. Buy a new one... there's been various generations of Scarletts, and if I recall correctly they've improved the preamps on the later generations.

Like Brad says, no reason to overthink it, if you don't otherwise know what you want then a Scarlett is a great choice.
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by panoramic » Mon Apr 04, 2022 6:05 am

Larry Mal wrote:
Mon Apr 04, 2022 6:03 am
panoramic wrote:
Mon Apr 04, 2022 5:56 am


like the focusrite scarlet? People always recommend that one it seems.
Scarletts are good. I would probably say that at their price point they are the industry standard at this point. Buy a new one... there's been various generations of Scarletts, and if I recall correctly they've improved the preamps on the later generations.
right on, I'll probably need to get some newer mic for vocals based on what i've seen. Any input on that? I'm looking for pretty okay but not expensive primarily.
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by Larry Mal » Mon Apr 04, 2022 6:23 am

panoramic wrote:
Mon Apr 04, 2022 6:05 am

right on, I'll probably need to get some newer mic for vocals based on what i've seen. Any input on that? I'm looking for pretty okay but not expensive primarily.
Well, vocals can be pretty individual specific, regardless I can't help but notice that all your microphones seem to be dynamics. So a nice large diaphragm condenser for vocals would seem an easy choice, maybe an inexpensive ribbon could be useful also. For the sake of money equaling value the LDC would be my first choice.

I have an Audio-Technica AT4050, that's a good microphone and can be found at a decent price.

That being said, though, I dream of better, and you have access to a much better resource in recommending an LDC at various price points in Brad here. Maybe tell us what you want to spend.

My only ribbon microphone is this SEelecronics Voodoo, though.

Ribbon microphones are popular right now, and again I'd like to get the budget together for a Royer or what have you down the road. But this Voodoo is a really good microphone.
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by Larry Mal » Mon Apr 04, 2022 6:25 am

Oh, and if you plan on recording vocals, I gotta return to the idea of room treatment. Brad will talk you into a tube driven Neumann before this thread is out, but even that will only produce awful sounding recordings if you are using it in an untreated room with all parallel surfaces.

Get a couple bass traps, get a couple wall panels.
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by marqueemoon » Mon Apr 04, 2022 6:28 am

I’d spend the bulk of the budget on a good mic pre with a DI.

If you can swing a Great River MP-1NV that’s my recommendation + an RNC. I like to compress some things a little on the way in.

Add a middling large diaphragm condenser and update the interface and that’s more or less it.

I really like my MOTU M4 and find myself using my ancient Oxygen 8 MIDI controller with it a lot.

My main piece of advice is to the extent possible give your setup a permanent home and have everything patched in and ready to go so you can sit down and be tracking within a minute or two.

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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by øøøøøøø » Mon Apr 04, 2022 6:44 am

There are lots of options in cheap condensers. Many of them are terrible.

In particular, there always seems to be a new flavor of well-advertised low- to mid-priced LDC. Two years on, they flood the used market. Rinse and repeat. Probably best to learn to spot and avoid mics that follow that trend.

In other words, look for cheap stalwarts that have been around awhile.

Audio technica 4033 is a little back electret that’s very cheap and can work okay.

An old AKG C414 B-ULS is a decent mic that used to be cheap-ish before the recent gear boom. Maybe it still is?

Buy someone else’s modified Oktava MK-219 or 319?

As alluded to above, these aren’t mics I use a whole lot (except the 414 B-ULS, albeit almost never on vocal). But you could do a lot worse if putting together a lean setup.

In your situation I wouldn’t be massively preoccupied with hardware for a start. But if you’re into DIY you can build a Hairball 1176 for a few hundred, and it’s always great to have an 1176 around.

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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by Larry Mal » Mon Apr 04, 2022 7:07 am

øøøøøøø wrote:
Mon Apr 04, 2022 6:44 am


Audio technica 4033 is a little back electret that’s very cheap and can work okay.
Just to follow up on this, with Audio Technica, the first number corresponds with how they view the microphones. That is, if it starts with a 2-, it's light use home stuff, if it starts with a 3-, then it's their prosumer grade stuff, and when you see a 4- like in the AT4033 Brad mentioned or the AT4050 that I mentioned they consider that to be their professional grade stuff.

The reason I mention this is because Audio-Technica is pretty ubiquitous and good value stuff. If you are looking for an LDC, maybe pick the price point you can afford and find a corresponding AT model. They can be found used very easily, they are very popular.

This isn't me telling you that they are great microphones or anything or that you should get them, however, like Brad mentioned, they have certainly stood the test of time in a lot of cases so you know you aren't getting some bullshit condenser du jour. The 4050 that I have has been around for 50 years, so people have certainly found it to be useful.

But like I say, don't spend a whole lot of time researching all of this, just get to work. If you can get a 4033 for a good price, get that, get to work, down the road you'll come to know the microphone well, including its limitations possibly. If so, then you will at least know what you are looking for in your next microphone.

The important thing is to just get working, it's an evolutionary process.
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Re: help me rebuild a cheap recording set up

Post by panoramic » Mon Apr 04, 2022 7:32 am

That's really good info on the audio technica stuff. I'll be looking to score something cheaper to start with but a few of those options Brad posted will likely come into my follows list on reverb. I'll start piecing this together quickly I'm sure.
The goal is to get these ideas down asap and ship them out to my old friends so we can sort out what to do.
I may also do some light hearted solo stuff with random drum machines

The MOTU m4 looks like a really nice interface, thanks Marquee
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