Which Rat....?????

Everyone needs a stompbox.
Post Reply
User avatar
jorri
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 3036
Joined: Thu May 07, 2009 1:53 am
Location: bath, UK
Contact:

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by jorri » Fri Oct 01, 2021 5:16 am

marqueemoon wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 5:24 pm
stevejamsecono wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:10 pm
This. Generally I'm running compression as a boost into it to start so it sounds pretty fat. SD-1 into it when I wanna go full on nuclear.

FWIW it's a very specific use item for me. I don't really understand the Rat's versatility rep because the only way it sounds good to me is if my Vox is already cooking a fair bit. When it's set into the clean Vox it sounds thin and harsh, and through previous amps (Fenders, etc.) it sounded super cheezy.

Granted, in this configuration it sounds sick, but that's really it as far as I'm concerned.
A light bulb went off for me when I got a treble booster. The way I tend to set a Rat that's the job it's doing, and I prefer a Rat in that role most of the time.

On the versatility thing, at the extreme ends of gain spectrum I'd rather use something else for sure, but what's cool about a Rat is what it does well is applicable to a wide variety of music.
In the end i use a Hudson Broadcast now for treble boosts but Rat gave inspiration (unlikely answer to 'what to replace rat with haha!). And for the fuzz well just DBA apocalypse, my diy design and combinations thereof with the hudson. The overdrive portion is the Hudson's high gain mode i suppose.
I mean, i could have just bought 3 rat pedals but no.

User avatar
stevejamsecono
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 4552
Joined: Tue Oct 17, 2006 10:55 am
Location: Brooklyn, NYC
Contact:

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by stevejamsecono » Fri Oct 01, 2021 5:20 am

marqueemoon wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 5:24 pm
stevejamsecono wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:10 pm
This. Generally I'm running compression as a boost into it to start so it sounds pretty fat. SD-1 into it when I wanna go full on nuclear.

FWIW it's a very specific use item for me. I don't really understand the Rat's versatility rep because the only way it sounds good to me is if my Vox is already cooking a fair bit. When it's set into the clean Vox it sounds thin and harsh, and through previous amps (Fenders, etc.) it sounded super cheezy.

Granted, in this configuration it sounds sick, but that's really it as far as I'm concerned.
A light bulb went off for me when I got a treble booster. The way I tend to set a Rat that's the job it's doing, and I prefer a Rat in that role most of the time.

On the versatility thing, at the extreme ends of gain spectrum I'd rather use something else for sure, but what's cool about a Rat is what it does well is applicable to a wide variety of music.
Agreed. It really wants to be an EQ thing on an amp, imo.

What treble booster did you get and do you prefer it to the rat at this point? I want to eventually get a hold of another one for my AC15 and had never thought to compare it to what the Rat does, but you're totally right.
And you find out life isn't like that
It's so hard to understand
Why the world is your oyster but your future's a clam

Resident Yamaha Fanboy

COYS

User avatar
marqueemoon
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 7343
Joined: Mon Jun 20, 2016 9:37 pm
Location: Seattle

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by marqueemoon » Fri Oct 01, 2021 5:58 am

stevejamsecono wrote:
Fri Oct 01, 2021 5:20 am
marqueemoon wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 5:24 pm
stevejamsecono wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:10 pm
This. Generally I'm running compression as a boost into it to start so it sounds pretty fat. SD-1 into it when I wanna go full on nuclear.

FWIW it's a very specific use item for me. I don't really understand the Rat's versatility rep because the only way it sounds good to me is if my Vox is already cooking a fair bit. When it's set into the clean Vox it sounds thin and harsh, and through previous amps (Fenders, etc.) it sounded super cheezy.

Granted, in this configuration it sounds sick, but that's really it as far as I'm concerned.
A light bulb went off for me when I got a treble booster. The way I tend to set a Rat that's the job it's doing, and I prefer a Rat in that role most of the time.

On the versatility thing, at the extreme ends of gain spectrum I'd rather use something else for sure, but what's cool about a Rat is what it does well is applicable to a wide variety of music.
Agreed. It really wants to be an EQ thing on an amp, imo.

What treble booster did you get and do you prefer it to the rat at this point? I want to eventually get a hold of another one for my AC15 and had never thought to compare it to what the Rat does, but you're totally right.
I got an EQD Bows. I really don’t prefer it to a Rat at this point. A lot of that is pandemic-related though. Fewer opportunities to crank up an amp, and a Rat at least has a filter control.

In treble booster mode it completely lops off the low end, and the full range mode on its own is pretty tubby. I need to experiment more though. In the right situation it’s great.

User avatar
spiffy chap
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1107
Joined: Mon May 07, 2007 12:42 am
Contact:

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by spiffy chap » Fri Oct 01, 2021 9:25 am

I use a Pigdog Vulture in the beginning of my chain which feeds into a ‘79 tone knob RAT

Using ‘66 Fender Bassman though

User avatar
JSett
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 8803
Joined: Mon Jun 01, 2009 1:33 pm
Location: Old Hampshire, Old England

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by JSett » Wed Oct 06, 2021 10:27 am

Tonight I'm mostly playing with 2 Rats. Double the fun...

Image
Silly Rabbit, don't you know scooped mids are for kids?

User avatar
MrShake
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1201
Joined: Tue Oct 24, 2006 5:51 am
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by MrShake » Sat Dec 04, 2021 5:56 am

Recently put a second Rat back on my board. I have a handful I like, all a little different (vintage, modded MIC, WFRI), all awesome. Modded ones get LM308s and a Turbo switch, but that's all I need to make a Rat a MegaRat. Even the circa 2010s ones with the OP07 sound really good (my bassist uses one), I just happen to like the touch response and EQ feel of the older ones. There may be a difference, but don't believe the hype. That said, I haven't played one made after about 2015.

Talking to my wife this morning about them, and can't find a pic of the latest board version from the Rat 2 with SMD parts. Was curious what they looked like, how much of the enclosure they took up, etc.

Didn't wanna start a new Rat thread (again), so can anyone share a pic of one of the most recent Rat 2 boards? I feel like the SMD change happened when they started using Boss-style power jacks around 2012. Does anyone have one they can use to post gut shots?

Or am I mistaken and they're still through-hole? I know Boss changed some classics to SMD, maybe I'm confused.

User avatar
Gavanti
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1712
Joined: Fri Jun 08, 2012 6:31 pm
Location: Des Noise, Idohiowa
Contact:

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by Gavanti » Sat Dec 04, 2021 6:45 am

Quick question about pedalboard friendliness : are the sloped enclosures taller at the back than the flat ones? One of the challenges with my turbo RAT was having to manage what pedals would still be accessible behind it.

User avatar
fuzzjunkie
Expat
Expat
Posts: 7276
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:32 am
Location: Seattle

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by fuzzjunkie » Sat Dec 04, 2021 11:36 am

Gavanti wrote:
Sat Dec 04, 2021 6:45 am
Quick question about pedalboard friendliness : are the sloped enclosures taller at the back than the flat ones? One of the challenges with my turbo RAT was having to manage what pedals would still be accessible behind it.
I don’t know, but I often place my big box vintage Rat pedal on the back row because it’s taller than my other pedals and is still easy enough to stomp on the back row.

All my delays have tap-tempo now, so I actually keep them in the front row and my dirt pedals go in the back. I know most people layout their boards in the opposite direction, but I want quick access to my delays. Fuzz pedals I can leave on the entire song and control with my volume knob. Except the Rat, but it’s on for the entire song whenever I use it.

Sauerkraut
Expat
Expat
Posts: 2827
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2006 6:23 am

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by Sauerkraut » Fri Dec 10, 2021 1:46 am

Anyone try the Lil´ Rat yet?

User avatar
solfege
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 544
Joined: Sat Feb 10, 2018 5:05 pm
Location: Philly

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by solfege » Sun Dec 12, 2021 2:05 pm

johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:48 am

I dont think I ever have. I kinda need to find something that'll handle chords as I have the spluttery thing covered a few times over but nothing with that big warm and woolly fuzz tone.

I might borrow my mates Swollen Pickle, see how that fairs.
I've got an OG first gen Swollen Pickle from '95 or so. It's one of the never sell it pedals.

User avatar
Maggieo
Expat
Expat
Posts: 13446
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2006 10:36 am
Location: Nebraska, USA
Contact:

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by Maggieo » Sun Dec 12, 2021 2:55 pm

I just picked up a used (duh) Turbo Rat. Should be fun.
“Now I am quietly waiting for/ the catastrophe of my personality/ to seem beautiful again.”- Frank O'Hara
I am not an attorney and this post is for entertainment purposes only. Please consult a licensed attorney in your state for legal advice.

User avatar
Jaguar018
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 8045
Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2008 6:48 am
Location: Burbs of Washington DC

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by Jaguar018 » Wed Dec 15, 2021 6:51 am

Maggieo wrote:
Sun Dec 12, 2021 2:55 pm
I just picked up a used (duh) Turbo Rat. Should be fun.
The very first pedal that I bought was a Boss OD-1 at the suggestion of a music store guy. That was before I knew a thing about pedals, or how to describe what I wanted. At the time, that pedal DID NOT do what I wanted. Overdrive=boring for my tastes-- back then at least.

The first pedal that I bought that I actually understood, wanted, and loved was a Turbo Rat. :-* I've pretty much had a Rat or Rat variant on my board ever since. I need to try out my Turbo Rat again (sadly not the original one that I got in the early 90s :'( ).

Sauerkraut
Expat
Expat
Posts: 2827
Joined: Mon Oct 02, 2006 6:23 am

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by Sauerkraut » Fri Dec 17, 2021 4:19 am

Here's my impressions of the Jam Rattler after spending some more time with it. I recently bought it to accompany my small box '80s Rat.

Most importantly, the gain sounds almost exactly like the original, it's just fantastic. Less positive: compared to the Rattler, the small box Rat has a wider, considerably more useful range in the lower, subtler gain area. There's a whole world of overdrive to be had between 7 and 9 o'clock. The Rattler seems to skip a lot of that, and with the gain at 8 o'clock it sound like the Rat at 9 o'clock, at 9 like the Rat at 10 etc. At high gain, they sound virtually identical. I'm not a big fan of the Rattler tone knob, finding it quite hard to dial in to a spot where it preserves enough of both the high and the low end for my taste, while retaining punch/cutting through. It tends to get either a tad too bright or just a bit too muffled. With the old Rat, even if the useful range of the filter knob is quite narrow, it's still wider than on the Rattler and I know exactly where to set it for it to sound good: as long as the gain is set under 10 o'clock, I set the filter anywhere between 1 and 3 o'clock and it'll be fine. If I turn the gain up past 10 o'clock, the filter can be set lower and quickly becomes almost irrelevant. I expect with time I'll learn to dial in the Rattler better, but it's definitely not as easy as with the Rat, and it seems to me that a filter knob just works better than a tone knob on a Rat.

That might sound quite negative, but I'm actually keeping the Rattler, because I'm using it for high gain, where I find it does as good a job as the original and the tone knob is far less important. I use the original Rat for subtler overdrive to edge-of-distortion stuff, which the Rattler's gain knob almost skips and where its EQ struggles to give me what I want. If I could only have one Rat, I'd chuck the Rattler out in a heartbeat and keep the original. Fortunately I can have two, because I like how they stack, and they stack a lot better to my ears than a Rat and a Klon (which was what I was trying before).
Last edited by Sauerkraut on Fri Dec 17, 2021 3:23 pm, edited 2 times in total.

User avatar
MrShake
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1201
Joined: Tue Oct 24, 2006 5:51 am
Location: Boston, MA
Contact:

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by MrShake » Fri Dec 17, 2021 7:57 am

I haven't played a ton of the boutiques, at least not more than a few minutes goofing around on friends' rigs. But having read a lot about 'em, it seems that the filter range is often the variable from one to the next. Interesting.

Great assessment, by the way. Glad it works for you as a high-gain option. It's funny how it seems to me the low-gain range of a Rat or clone is where a lot of the nuances come in when comparing them.

Maybe because once you crank them up, anything in that ballpark sounds pretty f'in good.

User avatar
fuzzjunkie
Expat
Expat
Posts: 7276
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:32 am
Location: Seattle

Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by fuzzjunkie » Fri Dec 17, 2021 8:25 am

The op amp used in a Rat isn’t designed to handle the high gain it’s being fed. The design is a result of a mistake. The wrong resistor was placed in the circuit and according to the creator of the Rat-
“The wrong resistor compromised the slew rate, it couldn’t handle it, but it let out a beautiful yowl, so I kept it that way.”

I can’t remember why he chose the original, backwards filter over a one of the standard EQ circuits. Probably to keep the circuit stable. It has been changed since then and the boutique builder’s have altered it too, so apparently not as important as the “wrong resistor.”

Post Reply