Which Rat....?????

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elektrovac
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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by elektrovac » Tue Sep 28, 2021 11:55 pm

Sauerkraut wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 7:20 am
Sauerkraut wrote:
Wed Feb 24, 2021 3:51 am
Sauerkraut wrote:
Tue Mar 05, 2019 3:47 am
I owned a 90s big box vintage reissue, a rat II and a turbo rat at some point in the '00s. I found the big box reissue was the best of those three. Then ten years ago I found a small box one from '86 for €85. I believe the hype now, it beat all the other ones. It's by far the best distortion pedal I ever owned and it's not going anywhere.
After watching this video, I'm now doubting the hype and ordering a new Rat. If it's really as good as/identical to my old one, I'm just gonna sell my '86. Like a sensible person.
So in the end I never sold the '86 Rat. I bought a Reuss Swiss Army Knife (Rat + Klon clone in one), thinking I'll sell the Rat, but after hours of comparing and tweaking and testing I ended up keeping both. The Reuss' Rat clone is great and it gets very close, but it's just not quite as good as the original to my ears. With the old Rat, no matter how I set the knobs, it just always sounds great, while with the Reuss I need to tweak and fine-tune to get there. It's a little more nasty/grimey, less creamy? I don't know how to describe it, but the difference is there, however small. The old one's super transparent too. I fell in love all over again. The main reason I'm keeping the Reuss is because its Klon clone is fantastic, I even prefer it to a Tumnus Wampler (less nasal), plus it's still got a good Rat and it's a super practical pedal to have around.

In short, I'd like to rejoin the 80s-Rats-are-magic camp. Sorry for ever doubting my Rat.
Did you try and compare the Reuss in standard Rat mode? The pedal ships preset to the MOD mode, which features a hybrid Si/Ge/LED clipping arrangement. In standard mode (symmetrical Si clipping), it should be very close to a vintage Rat.

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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by Sauerkraut » Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:35 am

elektrovac wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 11:55 pm
Did you try and compare the Reuss in standard Rat mode? The pedal ships preset to the MOD mode, which features a hybrid Si/Ge/LED clipping arrangement. In standard mode (symmetrical Si clipping), it should be very close to a vintage Rat.
I did, yeah, and it is very close. For all I know, the differences might be due to parts in the old one having drifted a little off-spec over time. Whatever the reason, it's a fantastic pedal that I'll happily continue to use. It just didn't make me sell my old Rat.

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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by Sauerkraut » Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:46 am

marqueemoon wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 8:40 am
Thanks for the Swiss Army Knife review.

As a Klone and Rat user myself I just don’t like the sound of the two stacked, and demos of this pedal haven’t changed my mind on that. If the switching were configurable on this I’d be all in.
I mostly agree with you, but not entirely: I think there are definitely better stack combinations out there than Rat + Klon, but stacking those two seems to work a lot better when the Rat goes first. My old Rat going into the Klon clone sounds much better than the Klon into the Rat.
Last edited by Sauerkraut on Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by JSett » Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:48 am

Jonesie wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 2:18 pm
Ever messed around with a Big Cheese / Big Cheese Clone? They're kinda a usable / sputtery thing. Not great for chords, but really cool for leads.
I dont think I ever have. I kinda need to find something that'll handle chords as I have the spluttery thing covered a few times over but nothing with that big warm and woolly fuzz tone.

I might borrow my mates Swollen Pickle, see how that fairs.
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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:59 am

johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:48 am
...I might borrow my mates Swollen Pickle, see how that fairs.
If you're looking for big, warm & wooly, but with even more tweakable variations, look no further.
They're every bit as indestructible as the old RATs too. Super solid!
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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by JSett » Wed Sep 29, 2021 1:13 am

PorkyPrimeCut wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:59 am
johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:48 am
...I might borrow my mates Swollen Pickle, see how that fairs.
If you're looking for big, warm & wooly, but with even more tweakable variations, look no further.
They're every bit as indestructible as the old RATs too. Super solid!
That's good to hear. I have a bit of an obsession with using durable or easily replaceable equipment and the Pickles are ubiquitous enough that I could grab one from almost any guitar shop. On any kind of gigging/touring rig, for me, it's gotta be as generic as possible so if something fails I can replace it almost immediately. Tremolo? TR2. Delay? DD3. Boost? Micro Amp. The only anomaly I've had was the Scrambler...so I'd always carry 2 spares with me 😂.
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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Wed Sep 29, 2021 2:16 am

johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 1:13 am
PorkyPrimeCut wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:59 am
johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:48 am
...I might borrow my mates Swollen Pickle, see how that fairs.
If you're looking for big, warm & wooly, but with even more tweakable variations, look no further.
They're every bit as indestructible as the old RATs too. Super solid!
That's good to hear. I have a bit of an obsession with using durable or easily replaceable equipment and the Pickles are ubiquitous enough that I could grab one from almost any guitar shop. On any kind of gigging/touring rig, for me, it's gotta be as generic as possible so if something fails I can replace it almost immediately. Tremolo? TR2. Delay? DD3. Boost? Micro Amp. The only anomaly I've had was the Scrambler...so I'd always carry 2 spares with me 😂.
If you do get one, remember to fiddle with the trimpots inside the pedal. I think, out of the box, they may be dialled all the way to the left but you can really open things up more by messing around with them. As many have said, there are maybe too many options but I really like mine.

It looks like they've been reduced in size & I've no idea about any other internal changes. Mine is one of the old re-issues.
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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by JSett » Wed Sep 29, 2021 2:40 am

PorkyPrimeCut wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 2:16 am

If you do get one, remember to fiddle with the trimpots inside the pedal. I think, out of the box, they may be dialled all the way to the left but you can really open things up more by messing around with them. As many have said, there are maybe too many options but I really like mine.

It looks like they've been reduced in size & I've no idea about any other internal changes. Mine is one of the old re-issues.
Ahh, I didn't know they had pots inside them. I'm not much of a knob-twiddler and value simplicity. I can normally get a usable sound out of anything pretty quickly. What appeals to me most about these is the variable mids...always an issue with Muff circuits. My buddy's one is the same as yours and he's just said I can give it a go and keep it if I like it 👌🏻
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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by marqueemoon » Wed Sep 29, 2021 7:27 am

Sauerkraut wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 12:46 am
marqueemoon wrote:
Tue Sep 28, 2021 8:40 am
Thanks for the Swiss Army Knife review.

As a Klone and Rat user myself I just don’t like the sound of the two stacked, and demos of this pedal haven’t changed my mind on that. If the switching were configurable on this I’d be all in.
I mostly agree with you, but not entirely: I think there are definitely better stack combinations out there than Rat + Klon, but stacking those two seems to work a lot better when the Rat goes first. My old Rat going into the Klon clone sounds much better than the Klon into the Rat.
That’s the order I use them in too, with the Rat set for more dirt of course.

It isn’t terrible, but isn’t better than either one on its own.

I prefer pairing them with a boost (after) if I need a little more.

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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by s_mcsleazy » Wed Sep 29, 2021 8:43 am

ok, how do you all set your rats? i've always had mine just on the verge of satuartion so when i run my boost into it, it gets louder and heavier without getting more saturated.
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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by JSett » Wed Sep 29, 2021 10:25 am

s_mcsleazy wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 8:43 am
ok, how do you all set your rats? i've always had mine just on the verge of saturation so when i run my boost into it, it gets louder and heavier without getting more saturated.
Mine has the Reutz mod for less gain and a smoother sound. I have the gain about 1/2-3/4 way up depending on guitar, filter all the way anti-clockwise.
Basically edge-of-breakup and dig in for a bit more kind of level. If it's going into an already overdriven amp I turn the gain down and the output up so it's more like a gritty boost
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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by marqueemoon » Wed Sep 29, 2021 1:34 pm

Gain around 10 or 11 o’clock depending on the specific one. For me a Rat is best in that crunchy 10-1 o’clock zone.

Filter a little past noon, just enough to tame the hashiness. Adjusting the filter correctly is the key to getting a good sound.

Volume to taste, but generally I use the Rat by itself so part of its job is to push the amp.

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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by jorri » Thu Sep 30, 2021 5:29 am

s_mcsleazy wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 8:43 am
ok, how do you all set your rats? i've always had mine just on the verge of satuartion so when i run my boost into it, it gets louder and heavier without getting more saturated.
I used to change the settings as its a verstatile pedal.
From treble boost to muff duty.
But i would say the filter followed the gain knob a bit, though never above 12oclock, it was often open when the gain was low. Higher gains roll of treble a bit in this circuit but not quite enough to dial out some fizz.

So basically ice pick>drive>distortion>DOOM and it was a clone so clipping and other options whatever i felt like. Soft clipping yes please on low gain, never on high much as it doesnt go beyond a certain threshold into distortion.

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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by stevejamsecono » Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:10 pm

marqueemoon wrote:
Wed Sep 29, 2021 1:34 pm
Gain around 10 or 11 o’clock depending on the specific one. For me a Rat is best in that crunchy 10-1 o’clock zone.

Filter a little past noon, just enough to tame the hashiness. Adjusting the filter correctly is the key to getting a good sound.

Volume to taste, but generally I use the Rat by itself so part of its job is to push the amp.
This. Generally I'm running compression as a boost into it to start so it sounds pretty fat. SD-1 into it when I wanna go full on nuclear.

FWIW it's a very specific use item for me. I don't really understand the Rat's versatility rep because the only way it sounds good to me is if my Vox is already cooking a fair bit. When it's set into the clean Vox it sounds thin and harsh, and through previous amps (Fenders, etc.) it sounded super cheezy.

Granted, in this configuration it sounds sick, but that's really it as far as I'm concerned.
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Re: Which Rat....?????

Post by marqueemoon » Thu Sep 30, 2021 5:24 pm

stevejamsecono wrote:
Thu Sep 30, 2021 3:10 pm
This. Generally I'm running compression as a boost into it to start so it sounds pretty fat. SD-1 into it when I wanna go full on nuclear.

FWIW it's a very specific use item for me. I don't really understand the Rat's versatility rep because the only way it sounds good to me is if my Vox is already cooking a fair bit. When it's set into the clean Vox it sounds thin and harsh, and through previous amps (Fenders, etc.) it sounded super cheezy.

Granted, in this configuration it sounds sick, but that's really it as far as I'm concerned.
A light bulb went off for me when I got a treble booster. The way I tend to set a Rat that's the job it's doing, and I prefer a Rat in that role most of the time.

On the versatility thing, at the extreme ends of gain spectrum I'd rather use something else for sure, but what's cool about a Rat is what it does well is applicable to a wide variety of music.

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