Good clanky solid state amps

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Maggieo
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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by Maggieo » Thu Jun 17, 2021 9:43 am

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by mbene085 » Thu Jun 17, 2021 6:34 pm

aboutstairs wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:54 pm
I use the Kemper direct into my recording setup (so through studio monitors) or into headphones. I don't own a standalone power amp. Profiles-wise I just use the popular ones, MBritt and TopJimi etc., with a general preference for Fender Twins and the brightest medium-gain Marshall SLs I could find. I'll admit with profiles I kind of just use them out of the box and haven't looked too much into tweaking the parameters. I have the factory Roland JC and the MBritt one and they've just never quite done it for me, but maybe they just need some adjustment.
Well, have you ever gotten other types of tones through that setup that you're truly happy with?

Because a Kemper through monitors really can't be compared to any of the amps you're cross-shopping here. You're basically listened to a modeled tone of an amp with a mic in front of the cab, recorded and played back on monitors. It always sounds different from being in the room with the amp. Most people listen to guitar cabinets off-axis but monitors on-axis, for one. More high end, more direct sound, less reflected room sound compared to an amp in the room.

If you get a clean solid state amp, be sure to get one with an effects loop. If you run your Kemper into the loop input, you'll be bypassing the preamp and just using its power amp and speaker. Disable the speaker IR on the Kemper, and you then get an A/B of the solid state preamp and the Kemper through a guitar cab. Plus, you can then use the Kemper as an amp in the room, too.

Or, you can get a cheap power amp like the EHX 44 Magnum and a guitar cab, and run the Kemper that way (or a nice, expensive power amp if you're so inclined). A lot of people find the missing link in their modeling experience when they hear the modeler through a power amp and guitar cab sitting on the floor instead of a cab IR and monitors pointed at their ears. It's the same amp, but a totally different way of listening to it. Nobody sits with their ear 1" from the speaker of a guitar amp, but that's how they're recorded and modeled. Super useful for recording or live situations where you'd be putting a mic on the cab anyway, but not how most guitarists are used to experiencing their amps.

It's like the difference between listening to someone sing in a room with you, and listening to them singing into a handheld mic played back through monitors or IEMs. A ton of direct, close-mic'd tone and not nearly as much room reflection as you're used to, with the added colouration of the microphone used. Recognizable as the same timbre, but yet sounding totally distinct.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by aboutstairs » Thu Jun 17, 2021 10:53 pm

mbene085 wrote:
Thu Jun 17, 2021 6:34 pm
aboutstairs wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:54 pm
I use the Kemper direct into my recording setup (so through studio monitors) or into headphones. I don't own a standalone power amp. Profiles-wise I just use the popular ones, MBritt and TopJimi etc., with a general preference for Fender Twins and the brightest medium-gain Marshall SLs I could find. I'll admit with profiles I kind of just use them out of the box and haven't looked too much into tweaking the parameters. I have the factory Roland JC and the MBritt one and they've just never quite done it for me, but maybe they just need some adjustment.
Well, have you ever gotten other types of tones through that setup that you're truly happy with?

Because a Kemper through monitors really can't be compared to any of the amps you're cross-shopping here. You're basically listened to a modeled tone of an amp with a mic in front of the cab, recorded and played back on monitors. It always sounds different from being in the room with the amp. Most people listen to guitar cabinets off-axis but monitors on-axis, for one. More high end, more direct sound, less reflected room sound compared to an amp in the room.

If you get a clean solid state amp, be sure to get one with an effects loop. If you run your Kemper into the loop input, you'll be bypassing the preamp and just using its power amp and speaker. Disable the speaker IR on the Kemper, and you then get an A/B of the solid state preamp and the Kemper through a guitar cab. Plus, you can then use the Kemper as an amp in the room, too.

Or, you can get a cheap power amp like the EHX 44 Magnum and a guitar cab, and run the Kemper that way (or a nice, expensive power amp if you're so inclined). A lot of people find the missing link in their modeling experience when they hear the modeler through a power amp and guitar cab sitting on the floor instead of a cab IR and monitors pointed at their ears. It's the same amp, but a totally different way of listening to it. Nobody sits with their ear 1" from the speaker of a guitar amp, but that's how they're recorded and modeled. Super useful for recording or live situations where you'd be putting a mic on the cab anyway, but not how most guitarists are used to experiencing their amps.

It's like the difference between listening to someone sing in a room with you, and listening to them singing into a handheld mic played back through monitors or IEMs. A ton of direct, close-mic'd tone and not nearly as much room reflection as you're used to, with the added colouration of the microphone used. Recognizable as the same timbre, but yet sounding totally distinct.
Oh yes, I'm Marshall'd and Vox'd up to my ears and there's a number of profiles I love for sure, it's really just this particular sound I can't seem to make happen. I've used the speaker in the DRRI with heads before so I do have that to an extent (Eminence Cannabis Rex in there though), and I'll take a look at a power amp for the Kemper sooner or later for gigs etc anyway. For a while my setup was so geared around recording dozens of takes in my bedroom for tunes that replacing the mic'd Deluxe with a Kemper profile was a godsend and sounded close enough to my ear (and FWIW I couldn't get a blackface sound I liked out of any plugins, not Helix, Nembrini, IK, NI, Brainworx, Scuffham, Positive Grid, not that I need to sell you on the Kemper here :P), and using a Kemper with a cab and miking it up seemed silly. The fact that I've never actually heard the Kemper as an "amp in the room" is definitely something to think about.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by aboutstairs » Fri Jun 18, 2021 3:44 am

Maggieo wrote:
Thu Jun 17, 2021 9:43 am
How about we let Andy tell us? Rig Rundown - Gang of Four's Andy Gill
Yeah, in scouring the internet as much as I could for info the best I could get from actual interviews is that Andy Gill used one specific old Carlsbro for a while and then 6L6 Peaveys in the 2010s. Anecdotally some Lab Series stuff too but those aren't easy to find either.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by aboutstairs » Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:04 am

johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:49 pm
aboutstairs wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:55 pm
johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 12:44 pm
Peavey or Traynor will both do this in spades.

Where are you based? Theres almost always a few Stingrays for sale in the UK. I just checked and there's 3 on FB Marketplace right now. and cheap.
Based in West Coast USA. Actual Carlsbros are hard to find on Reverb and eBay.
Ah, yeah in the States they're not particularly common. I've sourced a couple of HH amps for people before that struggled over there... HH and Carlsbro amps are so common they're almost used as doorstops here 😂
Holy absolute fuckin moley are people trying to get rid of them in the UK. Just dozens and dozens on FB Marketplace, almost all way under 100 GBP and some lying around for months. Yikes.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by aboutstairs » Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:23 am

jorri wrote:
Thu Jun 17, 2021 8:10 am
johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:49 pm
aboutstairs wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 4:55 pm


Based in West Coast USA. Actual Carlsbros are hard to find on Reverb and eBay.
Ah, yeah in the States they're not particularly common. I've sourced a couple of HH amps for people before that struggled over there... HH and Carlsbro amps are so common they're almost used as doorstops here 😂
True, they are pretty british things i suppose. Even the music school had an HH for guitar lessons i went to as a kid.
But that cyan colour front panel lighting? Almost worth using just for that. I find them the grittiest out of what i mentioned.
Worth noting both carlsboro and HH have tranformers, despite having no tubes, am told this is a large part of tube amps sound, so there is an element of grittiness or odd harmonics one might not expect from contemporary solid states. And i dont know if the distortion utilised that but that "valve sound" or "suzz" are great, like better than tubescreamer/bluesdriver great imho.
Apparently Carlsbro made the Suzz as a standalone pedal and the circuit is supposedly very similar to the MXR Distortion+/DOD 250. If they just put that onboard the amps, that's what that is. I've been looking for an excuse to grab a 250 clone anyway.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by jorri » Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:37 am

aboutstairs wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:23 am
jorri wrote:
Thu Jun 17, 2021 8:10 am
johnnysomersett wrote:
Wed Jun 16, 2021 9:49 pm


Ah, yeah in the States they're not particularly common. I've sourced a couple of HH amps for people before that struggled over there... HH and Carlsbro amps are so common they're almost used as doorstops here 😂
True, they are pretty british things i suppose. Even the music school had an HH for guitar lessons i went to as a kid.
But that cyan colour front panel lighting? Almost worth using just for that. I find them the grittiest out of what i mentioned.
Worth noting both carlsboro and HH have tranformers, despite having no tubes, am told this is a large part of tube amps sound, so there is an element of grittiness or odd harmonics one might not expect from contemporary solid states. And i dont know if the distortion utilised that but that "valve sound" or "suzz" are great, like better than tubescreamer/bluesdriver great imho.
Apparently Carlsbro made the Suzz as a standalone pedal and the circuit is supposedly very similar to the MXR Distortion+/DOD 250. If they just put that onboard the amps, that's what that is. I've been looking for an excuse to grab a 250 clone anyway.
Ooh i did not know that because i actually considered reverse engineering it into a pedal.
Ive never actually used a D+/250.
Suzz can be played clean up to a doomy amp drive.
Its very warm sounding to me.
Also, depends where in the circuit?

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by jorri » Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:50 am

jorri wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:37 am
aboutstairs wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:23 am
jorri wrote:
Thu Jun 17, 2021 8:10 am


True, they are pretty british things i suppose. Even the music school had an HH for guitar lessons i went to as a kid.
But that cyan colour front panel lighting? Almost worth using just for that. I find them the grittiest out of what i mentioned.
Worth noting both carlsboro and HH have tranformers, despite having no tubes, am told this is a large part of tube amps sound, so there is an element of grittiness or odd harmonics one might not expect from contemporary solid states. And i dont know if the distortion utilised that but that "valve sound" or "suzz" are great, like better than tubescreamer/bluesdriver great imho.
Apparently Carlsbro made the Suzz as a standalone pedal and the circuit is supposedly very similar to the MXR Distortion+/DOD 250. If they just put that onboard the amps, that's what that is. I've been looking for an excuse to grab a 250 clone anyway.
Ooh i did not know that because i actually considered reverse engineering it into a pedal.
Ive never actually used a D+/250.
Suzz can be played clean up to a doomy amp drive.
Its very warm sounding to me.
Also, depends where in the circuit?
I didnt analyse the circuit but if it was a clone, its one with no diodes, fully IC, which might explain its amp-like behaviour.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by fuzzjunkie » Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:21 pm

I loved Andy Gill and Daniel Ash for their abrasive post punk tones. I used an old Yamaha SS amp for a while trying to sound like an H|H amp, with a Distortion + in front and a Telecaster. I moved on from that pretty quickly to Fender amps and tape echoes because no one in Texas wanted anything to do with SS amps in the '80s. Had to be tubes.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by cestlamort » Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:14 pm

Maybe keep an eye out for the old Acoustic amps too, as they can be $100 of solid state fun and almost a less Hi-Fi JC alternative.
The peavey chorus combos are great as well

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by noisepunk » Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:19 pm

fuzzjunkie wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:21 pm
I moved on from that pretty quickly to Fender amps and tape echoes because no one in Texas wanted anything to do with SS amps in the '80s. Had to be tubes.
really, the later high-wattage fenders (especially the UL models) are clean and hi-fi enough to get the kinds of sounds most of these SS amps can get... even down to similarly harsh OD.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by aboutstairs » Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:13 am

cestlamort wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:14 pm
Maybe keep an eye out for the old Acoustic amps too, as they can be $100 of solid state fun and almost a less Hi-Fi JC alternative.
The peavey chorus combos are great as well
Yeah, Acoustic Ctrl Corp stuff is pretty plentiful on Reverb in the States and not super expensive, though it's harder to find demos of people using them on guitar than bass.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by fuzzjunkie » Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:58 am

noisepunk wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 8:19 pm
fuzzjunkie wrote:
Fri Jun 18, 2021 2:21 pm
I moved on from that pretty quickly to Fender amps and tape echoes because no one in Texas wanted anything to do with SS amps in the '80s. Had to be tubes.
really, the later high-wattage fenders (especially the UL models) are clean and hi-fi enough to get the kinds of sounds most of these SS amps can get... even down to similarly harsh OD.
Oh yeah, it was less about sound and more about aesthetics. Texas , gotta be manly and play tube amps type peer pressure. Even in the “break all the rules” punk camp. SS were seen as cheap and inferior even if they weren’t breaking down in the middle of a tour like a tube amp.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by noisepunk » Sat Jun 19, 2021 7:25 pm

fuzzjunkie wrote:
Sat Jun 19, 2021 8:58 am
Oh yeah, it was less about sound and more about aesthetics. Texas , gotta be manly and play tube amps type peer pressure. Even in the “break all the rules” punk camp. SS were seen as cheap and inferior even if they weren’t breaking down in the middle of a tour like a tube amp.
oh yeah, i got what you were saying–that isn't so far off from how things were in denver when i first started gigging.

i guess my comment was directed at the OP, or just the topic.

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Re: Good clanky solid state amps

Post by aboutstairs » Thu Jun 24, 2021 1:09 am

I pulled the trigger on a Yamaha G30-112. An EGC guitar, too, tangential to this. Still messing with pedals and Kemper profiles too. Falling in love with the Boss DS-1 into clean Hiwatt and JC-120 profiles, the mushier Fuzz Factory and Intersound/IVP preamp too. I'd wager all of those turn the envelope of your signal into a compressed sausage, but those are the ones that made me go "oh shit, that's nasty, give me more." I might pick up a JC of some kind down the road as the more I hear of them in Kemper profiles and recordings, the more I like that crisp, perky clean thing in addition to how forward they are with gain pedals, even (especially!) forbidden ones like the DS-1. On the JC front, I do wish a little less attention was paid to the chorus in demos and whatnot, even though I've tried it and it is gorgeous, and more to the clean tone and how it plays w/ gain pedals, esp. if you're not necessarily looking for the washy shoegaze thing.

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