What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

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Larsongs
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What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Larsongs » Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:52 pm

I’ve been watching a Thread on another Forum... I never knew Combo Amps existed that had both & could be selected individually or blended via a Control Knob...

Some mentioned are the Egnater Rebel 30 Combo, Carr Telstar, Divided by 13 & others...

The idea is to have a small 20-30 Watt Combo Tube Amp that can do the Fender Sound & the Vox Sound in one Amp... plus have the ability to even blend the USA & Brit Sound via a Blend Control Knob..

Easy to travel with, very versatile....

The Egnater Rebel 30 is a under $1000.00 & a great Package... But being made in China is a turnoff to many.. The USA built mentioned above are quite pricey.. $2500+...

Do you guys know of any other Amps like this?? Any USA built under $1500.00? Do any of you use them?? Thoughts....

Here’s a link to the Egnater...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rf6VNFuAWbE

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by noisepunk » Fri Jun 11, 2021 8:09 am

i have a late 60's ampeg vt40 (the sqaure cab model, vs the later slanted-front model)– i didn't buy it for this, i just thought it sounded awesome, but they were supposedly designed to do exactly what your describing, and i personally think they kind of nailed it in some sense.

they were also designed to be able to use different kinds of power tubes without modification, though i can't remember which ones. it was designed for 7027a tubes, which i understand is a variation on a 6L6, and i know those (6L6s) are one of the tubes it can use without mods. i believe EL84s are also comparable, but can't remember.

anyways, great amp, fits your price range most days (they're on the rare side, so not always easy to find one), definitely not easy to travel with as it weighs more than my twin, but maybe worth trying if one crosses your path.
Last edited by noisepunk on Fri Jun 11, 2021 10:12 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by stevejamsecono » Fri Jun 11, 2021 9:56 am

I've played a few of those Rebels and had really inconsistent experiences. Two of them sounded amazing and the rest sounded kinda crappy. FWIW I didn't notice a massive difference when switching between the two sides tubewise. More boutiquey brands may have more luck with the concept, but considering that a lot of the low-watt Marshally clones are made with 6V6s and the smaller Fender Pro and Blues Jr amps come with EL84s, I'm inclined to think that that difference in sound has more going on than the powertubes.
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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Larsongs » Sat Jun 12, 2021 9:15 pm

I like to see & play a quality USA built Amp with the features the Rebel 30 has.. But, who makes it or them??? That seems like it would be an amazing Amp!

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by horseblanket » Sun Jun 13, 2021 9:27 am

The Mesa Blue Angel fits that bill. It's what Joe Gore played on the old PJ Harvey stuff.
Out of production but you can find them used:
https://www.mesaboogie.com/support/out- ... angel.html

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Larsongs » Sun Jun 13, 2021 1:48 pm

horseblanket wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 9:27 am
The Mesa Blue Angel fits that bill. It's what Joe Gore played on the old PJ Harvey stuff.
Out of production but you can find them used:
https://www.mesaboogie.com/support/out- ... angel.html
Says out of production..

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by sessylU » Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:04 am

I always liked the idea of the THD Flexi 50 for this sort of thing. Not a combo, not made anymore, and on the wrong side of the Atlantic.

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Dr Tony Balls » Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:05 am

Larsongs wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:52 pm
The idea is to have a small 20-30 Watt Combo Tube Amp that can do the Fender Sound & the Vox Sound in one Amp... plus have the ability to even blend the USA & Brit Sound via a Blend Control Knob..
I think you'll find that there's a LOT more to a Vox sound or a Fender sound than the output tubes.
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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Larsongs » Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:13 am

Dr Tony Balls wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:05 am
Larsongs wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:52 pm
The idea is to have a small 20-30 Watt Combo Tube Amp that can do the Fender Sound & the Vox Sound in one Amp... plus have the ability to even blend the USA & Brit Sound via a Blend Control Knob..
I think you'll find that there's a LOT more to a Vox sound or a Fender sound than the output tubes.
Good topic for discussion..

Speakers for sure.. In addition to Tubes & Speaker what else plays a big factor in each of their Sounds? Vox has a separate Gain or Top Boost.. But, what else?

Keep in mind I’m talking smaller Combo Amps like AC15 & DRRI... 15-22 Watts with Reverb...

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Logrinn » Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:38 am

Voxes are known for not having a negative feedback loop which supposedly also contributes to their sound.

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Dr Tony Balls » Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:12 am

Larsongs wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 7:13 am
Dr Tony Balls wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 6:05 am
Larsongs wrote:
Thu Jun 10, 2021 8:52 pm
The idea is to have a small 20-30 Watt Combo Tube Amp that can do the Fender Sound & the Vox Sound in one Amp... plus have the ability to even blend the USA & Brit Sound via a Blend Control Knob..
I think you'll find that there's a LOT more to a Vox sound or a Fender sound than the output tubes.
Good topic for discussion..

Speakers for sure.. In addition to Tubes & Speaker what else plays a big factor in each of their Sounds? Vox has a separate Gain or Top Boost.. But, what else?

Keep in mind I’m talking smaller Combo Amps like AC15 & DRRI... 15-22 Watts with Reverb...
I think you'll find that output tube type makes a very minor impact (possibly the least?) of the major players on the list. Here's what i'd consider the major differences between a Fender Deluxe Reverb and Vox AC-style (ignoring reverb and trem):

1) Speaker. HUGE impacts to the sound.

2)Negative Feedback. Vox amps have none and a DR has a ton. Including negative feedback decreases distortion, especially early on the volume dial.

3) Bias. DR has fixed bias, Vox AC15 and AC30 have cathode bias. Fixed tends to be more firm and crisp sounding, cathode bias is a little more compressed.

4) Phase inverter gain. Vox has more.

5) Preamp. This varies a lot because there are many Vox AC style preamps but a Top-Boost style will be brighter and have more gain than one on a DR.

6) Output tubes

Of course you could always buy a set of Yellow Jackets and plop some EL84s into a DR and see about the sonic difference You'll notice something but it wont be like playing out of a Vox.
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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Larsongs » Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:43 am

I've mentioned in previous Threads that I have Vox & Fender Amps.. Sometimes, I play both silultaneously thru a Keeley 30ms Double Tracker in Stereo & in Abbey Mode.. The blended Sound of both Vox & Fender together Double Tracked in Stereo is a great Sound!!!

But, it's a pain in the ass to haul 2 Amps, Guitars, Pedalboards & all the other stuff... I'd love to be able to haul 1 Guitar & 1 smaller 15-22 Watt Combo Amp when I travel to Sessions, Rehearsals & even Gigs..

I would be really like to try a Combo Amp that could Sound like a Vox, sound like a Fender & have blend Knob to mix both Sounds... 15-22 Watts with Reverb & Tremelo under 50 lbs..

As an experiment I tried a Celestion Alnico Blue (made in UK) Speaker in my 65 DRRI yesterday.. It sounds worlds better than Jensen Special Design Speaker that comes in the Fender!!!! Did it sound like my AC15? No.. I'm not sure it's the Sound I'm looking for? But, a Speaker upgrade will do much to improve the Sound of the 65 DRRI's..

I also find the Fender 68 Custom Deluxe Reverb to be a very interesting & versatile Amp... I have to play one of those..

Anyhow, I really want simplicity. Less is more for travelling. 1 versatile Electric Guitar & 1 versatile Combo Amp to make it easy on me....

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by horseblanket » Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:41 pm

Larsongs wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 1:48 pm
horseblanket wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 9:27 am
The Mesa Blue Angel fits that bill. It's what Joe Gore played on the old PJ Harvey stuff.
Out of production but you can find them used:
https://www.mesaboogie.com/support/out- ... angel.html
Says out of production..
I may have mentioned that. ;D

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Larsongs » Mon Jun 14, 2021 9:16 pm

horseblanket wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 2:41 pm
Larsongs wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 1:48 pm
horseblanket wrote:
Sun Jun 13, 2021 9:27 am
The Mesa Blue Angel fits that bill. It's what Joe Gore played on the old PJ Harvey stuff.
Out of production but you can find them used:
https://www.mesaboogie.com/support/out- ... angel.html
Says out of production..
I may have mentioned that. ;D
Indeed you did! I missed it!

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Re: What Amps have EL84 & 6V6 Tubes..

Post by Dr Tony Balls » Tue Jun 15, 2021 6:45 am

Larsongs wrote:
Mon Jun 14, 2021 10:43 am
I would be really like to try a Combo Amp that could Sound like a Vox, sound like a Fender & have blend Knob to mix both Sounds... 15-22 Watts with Reverb & Tremelo under 50 lbs..
Looking at it from a practical standpoint you might think that it would be pretty easy to just have a Vox and a Fender style preamp in one amp. A two headed snake like the bright and normal channels of a Marshall which you could blend with respective volumes. And you'd be RIGHT. You COULD do that, however those two preamps share common elements of the amp that would force inconsistencies from the source amps. Phase inversion, power tube bias, and negative feedback are all global elements to an amp (they affect all channels) and they are different on an AC30 vs a DR. The short answer is that having an actual AC30 and a DR in the same amp is impossible.

Now, the "sound like" part of your query is the subjective element. You might find something that fits your needs, but I think focusing on output tube type is barking up the wrong tree. Hell, you might find that the sound of two different speakers blending is impossible with just one speaker. Hard to say, but good luck!
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