...so, were/are the Vintera II a failure?

[Mojambo]

One thing this thread has reminded me of is that the golden age of the Fender vintage reissue guitars has definitely passed.

If I knew then what I know now, I would have bought as many AVRIs/AVs & MIM Classic series guitars as I could. Those were great guitars, better value than Vinteras and Am Vintage too, and now they’re extremely hard to find used.

[ldp54002]

One thing this thread has reminded me of is that the golden age of the Fender vintage reissue guitars has definitely passed.

If I knew then what I know now, I would have bought as many AVRIs/AVs & MIM Classic series guitars as I could. Those were great guitars, better value than Vinteras and Am Vintage too, and now they’re extremely hard to find used.

Fender Japan is kind of keeping the flame burning, though they're not to everyone's taste. No one would call them "vintage accurate" in most cases, though they tend to come a lot more classic colors than even AVRI offered. There's also the import process, which I didn't have any issues with, but some just don't want to take that on.

In general, the late 90s through about 2015 or so is an era of guitars I wish I could go back to now with my big boy job and adult spending power. In 2013, I held a 1966 Jaguar in my hand that was incredibly clean for its age. Just a few scratches and dings from use. It still had the case, with the original 1966 purchase receipt in the pocket. It need some fret work--probably a refret in general--and the foam on the mute was a black sludge. Other than that, it was a jem of a guitar. It was $2575 plus tax. I had to turn it down, I didn't have that kind of money to burn on "just a guitar" at the time. Flash forward to 2023, that same guitar would probably fetch $6k+.

[Mojambo]

One thing this thread has reminded me of is that the golden age of the Fender vintage reissue guitars has definitely passed.

If I knew then what I know now, I would have bought as many AVRIs/AVs & MIM Classic series guitars as I could. Those were great guitars, better value than Vinteras and Am Vintage too, and now they’re extremely hard to find used.

Fender Japan is kind of keeping the flame burning, though they're not to everyone's taste. No one would call them "vintage accurate" in most cases, though they tend to come a lot more classic colors than even AVRI offered. There's also the import process, which I didn't have any issues with, but some just don't want to take that on.

In general, the late 90s through about 2015 or so is an era of guitars I wish I could go back to now with my big boy job and adult spending power. In 2013, I held a 1966 Jaguar in my hand that was incredibly clean for its age. Just a few scratches and dings from use. It still had the case, with the original 1966 purchase receipt in the pocket. It need some fret work--probably a refret in general--and the foam on the mute was a black sludge. Other than that, it was a jem of a guitar. It was $2575 plus tax. I had to turn it down, I didn't have that kind of money to burn on "just a guitar" at the time. Flash forward to 2023, that same guitar would probably fetch $6k+.

Very true. The money just doesn’t go as far as it used to.

I’m just like you, since about 2015 or so I’ve just been less and less impressed with their new offerings.

[mschafft]

As for MIM Classics being superior to Vintera I, well both my 70 Classic and 60 Vintera strats needed work but are now stellar intsruments.
Past series are rare and fine-tuned but the new series are built just fine eventhough they leave the factory without a basic set sup apparently.

[justinfromohio]

I don’t feel that Japanese guitars are below the Vinteras on quality, just a different focus. For me, the woods and woodcraft on the Japanese guitars have been pretty much peerless in Fender’s lineup. That’s what I consider the fundamental part of any guitar. Yes, they do a lot of basswood bodies - or at least they did (not much experience with them over the past couple of years of releases) - and loads of people don’t like basswood/attach a ‘cheap’ label to it, but I’m not one of those people. The necks agave been sublime, but I can understand people not liking the specs on them. Specs aside, it’s the quality/craft on them that has stood out for me.

Japanese poly finishes aren’t what they were in the 90’s either. Those were indestructible but also sort of thick and drab coloured. More recent poly finishes remind me more of the glass polyurethane Fender have sometimes been using on their higher non-AVRI lines. Very nice; probably a bit more fragile than previously. Vintera’s, on the other hand, feel more like the old Japanese finishes or top of the line Squiers. Real thick and a bit muted.

Hardware and electronics on the Japanese guitars have traditionally been the weakest part. The Vinteras have been blowing them away on that, although again, not much experience with Japanese guitars of the past few years and apparently they’re using American electronics now.

The prices on Japanese imports are poor, although that’s largely to do with them coming through bedroom dealer’s stores. They can often be cheaper than Vintera II’s in the real world if you can get them or are patient.

But I do think Fender has been repositioning the Japanese guitars lately, with the upgraded electrics and a move away from 7.25” radii. No hands-on experience with the new direction, but it appears, from close-up photos I’ve been scouring, the fretboards may have taken a dip in finish quality. They look a bit Vintera to me, tbh.

I grabbed a new TVL Jazzmaster lately. Not a Vintera, but the first Mexican guitar I picked up that I felt matched the Japanese quality I perceive.. Not too far off an AVRI. Vinteras, I just can’t look past them as slightly nicer Squiers. Nothing the matter with that - some of my favourite guitars are Squiers - I just don’t know why I’d pay 3 times as much when I can swap the hardware and electronics on a Squier for less than half the difference. Possibly for the neck and rosewood, but I just don’t have a good experience on the quality of those on Vinteras.

Vintera’s aren’t bad guitars, but they’re just not worth today’s list prices to me. I think they’re insanely priced for what they are. My new rosewood TVL was £150 more than a Vintera II JM. No experience with the Vintera II JM’s, but if they’re just like the Vintera I’s, then the TVL is twice the guitar. We talk a lot about marginal gains as we go up the price scales of guitars, so such a gap in my perception of quality at such a slim price margin makes me think the Vintera pricing has gotten out of control.

If anyone is interested and on the fence, Amazon as of 12.11.23 has the TVL Jazzmasters for $1,154.

[GilmourD]

As for MIM Classics being superior to Vintera I, well both my 70 Classic and 60 Vintera strats needed work but are now stellar intsruments.
Past series are rare and fine-tuned but the new series are built just fine eventhough they leave the factory without a basic set sup apparently.

I'll be honest... I expect to do a setup on any guitar I purchase, be it a Squier Mini all the way up to a custom-ordered PRS.

[javier-san]

A buddy of mine just bought one of the jazzmasters in desert sand and I have to say that I am impressed. Neck feels nice, frets feel good and the vibrato feels great and the arms stays in place and isn't floppy. I'm not in love with the color options, but still, if I was looking for a new jazzmaster, I'd be looking at purchasing one of them.

Only time will tell if the Vintera II was a failure, but I'd say it's too soon to say.

[marqueemoon]

The only Vintera II I’ve even touched was a Tele at Guitar Center. To say that it was poorly set up implies that effort was put into setting it up, which is not true, but even ignoring the fretting out with half step bends it just didn’t feel like a good guitar. The neck was sticky and had an awkward profile, and despite not being what I would consider heavy it just felt dead.

[GilmourD]

Guitar Center

I'm going to repeat myself here... As a former GC employee, you can't evaluate a guitar based on a GC floor model. They are some of the most abused guitars I've ever seen, and I've some guitars get smashed against amps and stages.

[marqueemoon]

Guitar Center

I'm going to repeat myself here... As a former GC employee, you can't evaluate a guitar based on a GC floor model. They are some of the most abused guitars I've ever seen, and I've some guitars get smashed against amps and stages.

I know. Around here I’ve seen used guitars with rusty strings and caked in dust. It’s wild.

I’ve also always found their approach to the higher end stuff weird. Like why bother having fancy guitars if they’re under lock and key and nobody is available to help customers with them?

Seems like the whole model is about controlling cost over doing things that actually drive revenue.

[Surfysonic]

FWIW, I'm quite pleased with my Vintera and Vintera II guitars - fun modding platforms and I've been pleasantly surprised at how well-made (got lucky I guess) all of my Vintera and VIntera II guitars are. While I typically prefer chunky necks, these shallower but wider necks on the Vintera II guitars are very comfortable for me. Full disclosure, the stock pickups in all of them were fine but I've been on a hum-cancelling single coil pickup kick for a while now. All of these guitars have been upgraded with hum-cancelling/noiseless single coil pickups with the exception of the Vintera '50s Tele which has Fender CS Texas Special pickups.

Vintera '50s Tele (with Fender CS Texas Special pickups), '60s Mustang (with Ben Gibbard Signature Mustang neck and Fralin Hum-Cancelling Mustang pickups), and '50s Strat Modified (Fralin Hum-Cancelling Stratocaster pickups)...



Vintera II '70s Competition Mustang (with Kinman Punk-Stang pickups) and '50s Jazzmaster (Fralin Hum-Cancelling Jazzmaster pickups)...



All keepers.

[hulakatt]

Guitar Center

I'm going to repeat myself here... As a former GC employee, you can't evaluate a guitar based on a GC floor model. They are some of the most abused guitars I've ever seen, and I've some guitars get smashed against amps and stages.

Honestly, the fact that every Gibson ES-335 satin that I've played in a GC was still a great guitar is what let me feel fine purchasing one sight unseen earlier this year and I was not let down either!

[hulakatt]

FWIW, I'm quite pleased with my Vintera and Vintera II guitars - fun modding platforms and I've been pleasantly surprised at how well-made (got lucky I guess) all of my Vintera and VIntera II guitars are. While I typically prefer chunky necks, these shallower but wider necks on the Vintera II guitars are very comfortable for me. Full disclosure, the stock pickups in all of them were fine but I've been on a hum-cancelling single coil pickup kick for a while now. All of these guitars have been upgraded with hum-cancelling/noiseless single coil pickups with the exception of the Vintera '50s Tele which has Fender CS Texas Special pickups.

Vintera '50s Tele (with Fender CS Texas Special pickups), '60s Mustang (with Ben Gibbard Signature Mustang neck and Fralin Hum-Cancelling Mustang pickups), and '50s Strat Modified (Fralin Hum-Cancelling Stratocaster pickups)...



Vintera II '70s Competition Mustang (with Kinman Punk-Stang pickups) and '50s Jazzmaster (Fralin Hum-Cancelling Jazzmaster pickups)...



All keepers.

This level of modifying is honestly why I just build my own from parts rather than buying one, modding it and having a ton of extra parts lying around.

BTW, I absolutely adore that Comp-Stang!

[Surfysonic]

This level of modifying is honestly why I just build my own from parts rather than buying one, modding it and having a ton of extra parts lying around.

BTW, I absolutely adore that Comp-Stang!

I enjoy tweaking guitars with trusted and (usually) reliable platforms with modding potential. I do have an inordinate amount of stock pickups that I should just give away. I hang onto them if I decide to move the modded guitar and need to put it back to stock. That happens much less often now, admittedly. I'll have to do a big parts bin sale at some point.

I feel confident with Fender and (more often than not lately) Squier bodies, necks, etc. I've only bought 3 fully complete Vinteras - a long gone Jazzmaster with Pau Ferro neck (which came with some broken tuners), my still here '50s Tele, and the '60s Mustang. The '50s Tele is still complete other than new pickups and brass bridge and control plates for my preferred aesthetic/convenience (not a fan of ashtray bridges). I really wanted to like the '60s Mustang Pau Ferro neck but it's a bit too thin for me and since I heard how chunky the Ben Gibbons Signature Mustang neck was, welp, I decided to make that change happen (thanks to Stratosphere). The '50s Strat Modified, '60s Mustang were parts purchases also from Stratosphere. I guess another upside for going this route is there is no extended wait time to receive a custom component from an individual builder or small team of builders.

As for the Vintera II guitars, I guess I'm an outlier that loves the '50s Jazzmaster's "Duo-Sonic's Desert Sand finish/anodized gold" look. Other than the hum-cancelling pickups, I simply swapped out the knobs and tips.

Yeah, my Musikraft neck/MJT body JM partsbuild was well worth the cost and wait time. It's as "custom shop" level as I'll ever get as well as being more affordable than a Fender CS build or some other boutique builder. It's my #1 Jazzmaster.

I would love to plan more parts builds. However, I'm trying to focus on downsizing and appreciate having a few (by few, 10? - it's a goal, lol) special guitars. Problem is, I'm currently at 27 guitars and I have a ways to go. Some guitars will be easy to move on (especially if I don't end up bonding with them). Admittedly, some purchases were out of boredom and are easy to move on.

There's a Jazzzmaster body out there that I've seen - decently priced and it already has an appealing finish. Fortunately, I've been able to restrain myself from this impulse purchase. Since I have 4 Jazzmasters (2 too many, if I'm honest) , I really don't need another (let alone have room for).

Thanks, I adore the Vintera II '70s Competition Mustang, too. Every now and then, I wish it had the matching headstock but I'm fine without it. I honestly no longer feel the need to get any more Mustangs, vintage or otherwise due to this guitar. I'm good.

I guess since I've been on the noiseless/hum-cancelling kick, I'm finally over the vintage guitar hunt in general even though I'll always admire and appreciate them. With this in mind, it's making it a lot easier to let go of my '63 Jag at some point in the near future. Now, if I can apply all of this downsizing/appreciation logic to my vintage amp obsessions...baby steps I guess.

[efiug]

I have a Vintera II competition burgundy mustang bass that I got for a really good deal on a "B-Stock" one (it looked completely brand new to me). I would have preferred the orange one but the deal was too good to pass up. Finish looks lovely in person and the rosewood board is nice too. I don't think I'd be unhappy with what I got even at full price too.


Pure Speculation/wishful thinking here on my part but I wonder if the original Vintera line will get relaunched as Vintera IIs with rosewood boards, would partially explain why the jazzmaster and jaguar were kinda oddball choices.