61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Discussion of vintage Jazzmasters, Jaguars, Bass VIs, Electric XIIs and any other offset-waist instruments.
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raymanrock
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61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by raymanrock » Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:34 am

Hi, i'm looking for some thoughts on below 2 jazzmasters. I haven't played a vintage jazzmaster before but i always want one. I have a 62 AVRI with Rothstein S15 Prewired kit(i keep the stock neck pickup) and it sounds amazing on the lead middle and bridge position. Really sparkling sounding. Do you guys think i can get a even better sounding jazzmaster?

Since i like light weight guitars, i found below two. The 61 is 7.8lbs and the 64 is even better, 7.5lbs. I like the look of the rosewood fretboard on the 64, but the slab board 61 seems to be more desirable to collectors. Would you kindly share your thoughts? And do you think their price is reasonable? Tks in advance!

https://reverb.com/item/28557292-fender ... 1-sunburst
https://reverb.com/item/12322261-1964-fender-jazzmaster

Rayman
Last edited by raymanrock on Thu Nov 28, 2019 6:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by thisisnickpaige » Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:15 am

Can’t speak to sound but am I off to think these prices are criminally high?

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by gringopig » Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:37 am

Both guitars are lovely and spot on. I have 2 originally bought from Gary's classic guitars and they are great!

Prices are fine for what these are and the '61 slab is certainly more sought after. The prices are not high in today's market. If you want high, check out some custom colour Stratocasters from the same years. Even sunbursts are >£20k in GBP. Ouch.
Both of these guitars will be an absolute pleasure to own and play and I don't think the prices are high at all.

Good luck!

EDIT: Check the volume pot has been only replaced with another 1M ohm potentiometer and not changed out for a 250k ohm. That would change the whole tone of the instrument.
Also, ask for internal shots as well. Both sellers have good reputations and I would trust Gary's implicitly but ask for internal shots and for pot values and codes on the '61

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Thu Nov 28, 2019 6:24 am

That '61 looks killer and it's cheaper than the '64.

Buy it!!!
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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by bterry » Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:43 am

I’m going to offer a contrary opinion and caveat, here :)

$6850 for a ‘61 that’s not 100% original is a bit high, but Southside usually deals a bit so you could probably talk them down some. If you’re a little patient you can find a 100% original ‘61 for the same $$$. Or, better yet, a nice late 1959 JM for around $8000-$8500k.

Also, the Southside guys are cool but they consign a lot which means on those pieces they can be a bit loose with the details. If you buy something from them I would make sure you have an approval period and I would verify everything on the guitar.

Also, just my .02 cents, if you can afford to spend $7000-$8000 on a vintage Jazzmaster I would hold out for something 100% original and clean, no matter what year/model you end up buying!

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by raymanrock » Thu Nov 28, 2019 6:30 pm

gringopig wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 3:37 am
Both guitars are lovely and spot on. I have 2 originally bought from Gary's classic guitars and they are great!

Prices are fine for what these are and the '61 slab is certainly more sought after. The prices are not high in today's market. If you want high, check out some custom colour Stratocasters from the same years. Even sunbursts are >£20k in GBP. Ouch.
Both of these guitars will be an absolute pleasure to own and play and I don't think the prices are high at all.

Good luck!

EDIT: Check the volume pot has been only replaced with another 1M ohm potentiometer and not changed out for a 250k ohm. That would change the whole tone of the instrument.
Also, ask for internal shots as well. Both sellers have good reputations and I would trust Gary's implicitly but ask for internal shots and for pot values and codes on the '61
Tks for the advice!I will check more details before I buy.

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by raymanrock » Thu Nov 28, 2019 6:34 pm

bterry wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 8:43 am
I’m going to offer a contrary opinion and caveat, here :)

$6850 for a ‘61 that’s not 100% original is a bit high, but Southside usually deals a bit so you could probably talk them down some. If you’re a little patient you can find a 100% original ‘61 for the same $$$. Or, better yet, a nice late 1959 JM for around $8000-$8500k.

Also, the Southside guys are cool but they consign a lot which means on those pieces they can be a bit loose with the details. If you buy something from them I would make sure you have an approval period and I would verify everything on the guitar.

Also, just my .02 cents, if you can afford to spend $7000-$8000 on a vintage Jazzmaster I would hold out for something 100% original and clean, no matter what year/model you end up buying!
Tks man! If I buy a very clean vintage guitar, I might feel guilty playing it :fp:

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by aliendawg » Thu Nov 28, 2019 7:57 pm

Well I guess it really depends... Are you looking for a collector's piece or are you looking for THE player??? Because if you're looking for the latter then I would gladly pay a little more even if it's not originally. Of course it has to play GREAT
"With the resurgence of offsets it seems like we're also seeing a resurgence of people who don't know what to do with them" - 601210

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by raymanrock » Thu Nov 28, 2019 10:10 pm

aliendawg wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 7:57 pm
Well I guess it really depends... Are you looking for a collector's piece or are you looking for THE player??? Because if you're looking for the latter then I would gladly pay a little more even if it's not originally. Of course it has to play GREAT
If it's a vintage Jazzmaster, I'll play it at home and studio only. To bad that I can't try one in person before I buy..

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by mgeek » Fri Nov 29, 2019 3:03 am

"Listed over 1 year ago by Gary's Classic Guitars LLC"

It doesn't take over a year to sell a guitar, unless it's overpriced.

There are loads and loads of these guitars technically for sale, but if you look at ebay 'sold items' at the moment (i think it shows you the last three months of sales) there is exactly ... ONE vintage Jazzmaster that's actually sold in that time. And not for as much as either of these

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R ... =1&_sop=16

It's easy to see all those 5k+ plus listings and think that's the going rate, but the amounts these change hands for behind the scenes is far less, and the idea that they are just going to keep going up and up is laughable.

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by blacktiger » Fri Nov 29, 2019 3:20 pm

raymanrock wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:34 am
Do you guys think i can get a even better sounding jazzmaster?
Maybe? IMO, the reason for buying vintage isn’t necessarily tone. You can get more or less any sound you want from a new offset these days with the various aftermarket pick-ups and parts out there. I would buy vintage more for feel than anything else. A good vintage guitar is a delight to play. I personally also really like the idea of guitars/amps that have a decades-long history and were built (more or less) by hand rather than by a machine (or multiple machines). That closer-to-handmade factor also means that there is more variation - for better or for worse - in those instruments. I’ve owned many ‘60s Jazzmasters. All sounded like Jazzmasters, but no two sounded exactly alike.
my vinyl weighs a ton

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by bterry » Fri Nov 29, 2019 6:49 pm

mgeek wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 3:03 am
"Listed over 1 year ago by Gary's Classic Guitars LLC"

It doesn't take over a year to sell a guitar, unless it's overpriced.

There are loads and loads of these guitars technically for sale, but if you look at ebay 'sold items' at the moment (i think it shows you the last three months of sales) there is exactly ... ONE vintage Jazzmaster that's actually sold in that time. And not for as much as either of these

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R ... =1&_sop=16

It's easy to see all those 5k+ plus listings and think that's the going rate, but the amounts these change hands for behind the scenes is far less, and the idea that they are just going to keep going up and up is laughable.
Ebay and Reverb are terrible places to judge actual vintage guitar pricing. Almost all good+ vintage guitars get sold via private sales or via dealers with good client lists. 99.9% of the stuff on Ebay/Reverb are guitars that dealers can’t/won’t sell and the prices never reflect actual sales prices, low or high. This also goes for Reverb’s ‘price guide’, it’s complete rubbish.

Also, keep in mind that many of the high-priced pieces on those sites are consigned through dealers, hence they are priced way too high and the dealers often don’t feel like they have any responsibility to back up claims of originality, etc. It’s generally not a good situation to get into unless you really know your stuff.

Almost no great slab board Jazzmaster is going to sell for less than $5k. The prices are firmly in the $6500 and up range for a good one, depending on year and condition. Prices have been going up on them for a few years now, and great custom color examples are selling for $20k and up.

The key is knowing what to buy and who to buy from. A lot of people buy vintage guitars, but most of them are clueless about the whole thing.

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by raymanrock » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:12 pm

blacktiger wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 3:20 pm
raymanrock wrote:
Thu Nov 28, 2019 1:34 am
Do you guys think i can get a even better sounding jazzmaster?
Maybe? IMO, the reason for buying vintage isn’t necessarily tone. You can get more or less any sound you want from a new offset these days with the various aftermarket pick-ups and parts out there. I would buy vintage more for feel than anything else. A good vintage guitar is a delight to play. I personally also really like the idea of guitars/amps that have a decades-long history and were built (more or less) by hand rather than by a machine (or multiple machines). That closer-to-handmade factor also means that there is more variation - for better or for worse - in those instruments. I’ve owned many ‘60s Jazzmasters. All sounded like Jazzmasters, but no two sounded exactly alike.
That's enlightening, thank you! I have a refinished 64 jaguar and I can see that it's "feel" is better than it's tone.

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Re: 61 and 64 Jazzmaster thoughts?

Post by raymanrock » Mon Dec 02, 2019 6:29 pm

bterry wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 6:49 pm
mgeek wrote:
Fri Nov 29, 2019 3:03 am
"Listed over 1 year ago by Gary's Classic Guitars LLC"

It doesn't take over a year to sell a guitar, unless it's overpriced.

There are loads and loads of these guitars technically for sale, but if you look at ebay 'sold items' at the moment (i think it shows you the last three months of sales) there is exactly ... ONE vintage Jazzmaster that's actually sold in that time. And not for as much as either of these

https://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R ... =1&_sop=16

It's easy to see all those 5k+ plus listings and think that's the going rate, but the amounts these change hands for behind the scenes is far less, and the idea that they are just going to keep going up and up is laughable.
Ebay and Reverb are terrible places to judge actual vintage guitar pricing. Almost all good+ vintage guitars get sold via private sales or via dealers with good client lists. 99.9% of the stuff on Ebay/Reverb are guitars that dealers can’t/won’t sell and the prices never reflect actual sales prices, low or high. This also goes for Reverb’s ‘price guide’, it’s complete rubbish.

Also, keep in mind that many of the high-priced pieces on those sites are consigned through dealers, hence they are priced way too high and the dealers often don’t feel like they have any responsibility to back up claims of originality, etc. It’s generally not a good situation to get into unless you really know your stuff.

Almost no great slab board Jazzmaster is going to sell for less than $5k. The prices are firmly in the $6500 and up range for a good one, depending on year and condition. Prices have been going up on them for a few years now, and great custom color examples are selling for $20k and up.

The key is knowing what to buy and who to buy from. A lot of people buy vintage guitars, but most of them are clueless about the whole thing.
Very useful info. I also have such kind of wonder before: If the 64 jazzmaster is a good one, why it's listed over 1 year? I don't know the answer, maybe that guitar is not that good..

I know what to buy but don't know who to buy from. Reverb seems to be my only source.. I can't try the guitar in person so the only thing i can do is to make sure the shop is with good reputation. :(

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