Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
- Despot
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
I thought the bronze effect was less to do with the yellowing of the clear coat than it was to do with the fading of the red over metallic that creates the CAR finish?
I love how these Mustangs look - I've always liked guitars with a bit of wear or colour fading more than mint guitars.
I love how these Mustangs look - I've always liked guitars with a bit of wear or colour fading more than mint guitars.
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
Maybe, I'd not heard that before. What colour was sprayed underneath the red?
Check this out. The red is solid & the yellow is knocked down to 20% opacity, kinda like a tinted clearcoat.
The bit in the middle doesn't look too far off the red in the photo of the Mustang...
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- Despot
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
That's pretty cool Mark - I'd assumed that yellow over red wouldn't come through the same way as it does on blue ... but clearly it does.
I think CAR used both silver and gold base coats, then a transparent red is shot over the metallic with a clear coat to protect the less robust under coats. I'm pretty certain that my old LPB Jaguar had a metallic silver down first and blue sprayed over it (you could see where there was pure blue with no metallic in the neck cavity in a narrow line between the bit that did have metallic sprayed under and the bare wood where the paint stick was used) - so it was either silver or gold under the red coat.
I'm not sure though - I know on Gibsons that thin red coats in ... say ... a sunburst would fade. I've seen that even on my old '65 ES330 which had faded from a cherry sunburst to a tea burst on the front. But then again the Compstang is a poly finish rather than nitro. I'm not sure how the undercoats were applied in the poly years - probably completely different than in the nitro years.
I think CAR used both silver and gold base coats, then a transparent red is shot over the metallic with a clear coat to protect the less robust under coats. I'm pretty certain that my old LPB Jaguar had a metallic silver down first and blue sprayed over it (you could see where there was pure blue with no metallic in the neck cavity in a narrow line between the bit that did have metallic sprayed under and the bare wood where the paint stick was used) - so it was either silver or gold under the red coat.
I'm not sure though - I know on Gibsons that thin red coats in ... say ... a sunburst would fade. I've seen that even on my old '65 ES330 which had faded from a cherry sunburst to a tea burst on the front. But then again the Compstang is a poly finish rather than nitro. I'm not sure how the undercoats were applied in the poly years - probably completely different than in the nitro years.
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
Gold would definitely help accentuate the bronziness. Saying that though, I'm not sure how a CAR finish would suddenly become semi-translucent.
I could be wrong but I think the early ones were nitro. My 72' was definitely poly (unfortunately) and showed no sign of checking whatsoever. Some of the 60s ones with matching headstock though, that's a different story. Checking all over the place, normally a sign of nitrocellulose.
I could be wrong with both these post though. It wouldn't be the first time.
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- Despot
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
iirc the process was to shoot a metallic undercoat (silver or gold depending on the year) and then to shoot a translucent red coat over that. The red pigment, being photoreactive, would basically fade out letting the undercoat come through more depending on whether or not it spent much time exposed to strong UV light over it's lifetime.PorkyPrimeCut wrote: ↑Tue Mar 20, 2018 6:45 am
Gold would definitely help accentuate the bronziness. Saying that though, I'm not sure how a CAR finish would suddenly become semi-translucent.
The CAR effect (as with LPB and BMM) is basically a metallic base coat with an overcoat of a translucent colour - when you see red metallic you're seeing two colours at once - the base coat and the tinting effect of the colour coat.
It's the same thing you see with Les Pauls from the '50s ... most of what you'd see as 'tea burst' or 'faded burst' all started out as identical cherry red LP bursts ... but their exposure to UV varied and so did the extent to which the red of their sunbursts faded over time.
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
Actually ... the best example of this is the Gibson colour Sparkling Burgundy.
You'll very rarely see this colour without some degree of fade ... and on the back of the neck you'll often see wear down to the gold undercoat (which has a red tinted coat shot on top of it to give the metallic red look) - though the gold (like on goldtops) will often be an off-green colour due to oxidisation.
I think the red pigment used by Gibson was way more prone to this than Fenders (as in the degree of UV light needed to fade a Sparkling Burgundy finish seems to have been much less than to fade the red pigment on a Fender), but I think Fenders are prone to this as well ... it just takes more UV exposure.
Sparkling Burgundy Gibsons (often found on ES guitars) tend to go to full bronze over time ... it's actually a beautiful colour when it's faded and a major plus factor for these guitars ... at least for me. Gibson folk don't seem to have as much love for SB as we do for CAR though ... a sparkling burgundy guitar is often cheaper than a standard cherry red finish.
You'll very rarely see this colour without some degree of fade ... and on the back of the neck you'll often see wear down to the gold undercoat (which has a red tinted coat shot on top of it to give the metallic red look) - though the gold (like on goldtops) will often be an off-green colour due to oxidisation.
I think the red pigment used by Gibson was way more prone to this than Fenders (as in the degree of UV light needed to fade a Sparkling Burgundy finish seems to have been much less than to fade the red pigment on a Fender), but I think Fenders are prone to this as well ... it just takes more UV exposure.
Sparkling Burgundy Gibsons (often found on ES guitars) tend to go to full bronze over time ... it's actually a beautiful colour when it's faded and a major plus factor for these guitars ... at least for me. Gibson folk don't seem to have as much love for SB as we do for CAR though ... a sparkling burgundy guitar is often cheaper than a standard cherry red finish.
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
^ ^ OK, this makes complete sense now. I'd not realised the top coat was translucent.
Either way, the resulting bronze/red colouration is simply stunning!
Either way, the resulting bronze/red colouration is simply stunning!
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
I’ve lusted over James Mercer’s Starfire for years.
The cool thing about fretless is you can hit a note...and then renegotiate.
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
Two of my most attractive guitars are green!
Oliver On Display, November 12, 2015 by Maggie Osterberg, on Flickr
Johnny Marr Jaguar, April 02, 2105 by Maggie Osterberg, on Flickr
The Happy Corner, April 02, 2015 by Maggie Osterberg, on Flickr
Oliver On Display, November 12, 2015 by Maggie Osterberg, on Flickr
Johnny Marr Jaguar, April 02, 2105 by Maggie Osterberg, on Flickr
The Happy Corner, April 02, 2015 by Maggie Osterberg, on Flickr
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- tammyw
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
These two were caught having a late night rendezvous. That gold guard looks horrible in the dim light.
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
Tammyw,
That Strat in particular looks incredible ! Details , please ?
Best,
Jeff.
That Strat in particular looks incredible ! Details , please ?
Best,
Jeff.
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
I think this 2014 Gretsch Custom Shop Masterbuilt Stephen Stern '59 Falcon NOS looks pretty amazing in Sage Green Metallic...
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Re: Do all green guitars look bad? Good examples?
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