New Guy building Vox Mk III

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Rgand
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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by Rgand » Mon Jun 10, 2019 6:54 am

I like the half bridges. They have a cool look all their own.
Image

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epizootics
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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by epizootics » Mon Jun 10, 2019 7:03 am

I agree with Rgand...Plus they look nicer than those hardtail strat bridges.

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by DrGonzo » Mon Jun 10, 2019 8:53 am

yeah the look better for sure but the main thing is i hate the strat tone (in my hands) :wacko:

also gives me the top loader option so i wouldn't have to drill through the body. but then this is only an option if i can't get an inexpensive original body from england...

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by epizootics » Mon Jun 10, 2019 12:20 pm

We'll find out tomorrow! I'll giv'em a call bright and early.

That was also the thinking with not going with the 25.5" scale length - getting away from the Strat tone, which plagues the cheapo reissues of these last few years. With the original pickups and a 25" or 24" scale, you're making sure you're keeping away from a strat-ish sounds.

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by DrGonzo » Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:08 pm

Man i really hope there is someone in that shop who still sells that stuff. Strat necks are too long and it was totally nerve wracking building the neck for the thunderbird.. and it was korina which is probably easier to work with than maple... i would like to avoid this process in the future!

also i‘m not going to spend 1300€ for that one vox mk neck on ebay!

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by DrGonzo » Mon Jun 10, 2019 3:10 pm

btw what’s that 5x5cm square in the template you made @epizootics?

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epizootics
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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by epizootics » Mon Jun 10, 2019 9:32 pm

I add one of those to all the templates I make - once you have it printed, you can re-measure it to make sure the dimensions match. Sometimes printers re-scale things automatically.
By the way, I made an updated version of the template. I scaled it up to match the body dimensions I found on RetroFret - I think we can safely assume none of the originals were a 24" scale length. This new one uses 25". https://drive.google.com/open?id=1p8pfA ... _7ddsxNbWa


Maple isn't that bad to work with, provided you remove as much of it as you can prior to routing and do some climb-cutting in the areas where the bit tries to pull the grain away from the piece you're working on, especially when using quartersawn stock. I've never had any tear-out working it this way. It's also one of the nicer woods when it comes to carving, the tight texture makes it respond really well to both chisels and spokeshaves. Looking at how good the Thunderbird turned out, I'd say you'd have no problems making a Vox neck :)

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by mgeek » Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:34 pm

That Guild build is incredible and from that I'd guess that you would like to get this Vox build as accurate as possible...so forget Brandoni.

They have *some* Italian Vox/Eko bits, but Brian Jones' mkIII was made in the UK. The Italian guitars are 25', the UK are 25.5, pickups are completely different. The only part that would have been common to both UK and Italian models are the tuners, and they don't have any of those now

Brian Jones' as you know was kind of a prototype. It used a Stratocaster bridge (JMI, the company behind Vox, imported Fender at the time, so had access to these parts). The jutting out bit where the trem arm screws in was roughly ground off, and the trem block hammered into a pretty tight hole. I think this feature would make it sound really different to a strat, if that's what you want. Most of the 'sound' of a strat comes from the trem springs imo

I've got a UK phantom, so can tell you what you need to know about the neck if you like, as they are probably the same (at least the production models are). The profile is quite slim at the nut, but gets quite fat by the 7th fret

Are you on Facebook? There are some knowledgeable people in this group who might be able to help with the longer body shape https://www.facebook.com/groups/106275042879089/

this video is good for having a proper look at it- they show the bridge thing quite clearly https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcZ2SiZhTHs
Last edited by mgeek on Fri Jun 21, 2019 2:07 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by DrGonzo » Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:58 pm

@mgeek

thanks. i‘ve watched this video more than once. better than the „john 5 plays brian‘s....“ :wacko:
that’s where i found out about the trem block. which is the reason why i‘m thinking about a tele tailpiece. the hammered-in block must make the tone thicker and give more resonance, which then should equal the tele tone. that’s my theory anyway... one part of me wants to make an exact copy, the other part just wants a white teardrop guitar that nails the tone. so i’m not quite sure here.

saldy i don’t really know the cosmetical difference between UK an IT pickups. i‘ve looked at photos of an italian vox and bought pickups that look different. they should arrive any moment now, maybe someone can ID those for me (thanks for that FB link).

so you’re saying Brian‘s must be 25,5 scale lenght?

can you compare the neck profile and thickness to gibson necks? 59ish or more like mid 50s? (fat or really fat..)
C or D shaped?

@epizootics thank you so much...

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by PorkyPrimeCut » Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:43 am

Musjagjazz wrote:
Sat Jun 08, 2019 7:35 am
There was a forumite who visited Brandoni Guitars in the UK who have new old stock of Vox, Eko, etc..
That was me :)
mgeek wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 10:34 pm
...I'd guess that you would like to get this Vox build as accurate as possible...so forget Brandoni.
Yep. What original Vox parts he did have will be on new builds by now. I'm sure he still has tons of hardware but it'll be things like tuners, bridges & knobs. The really good stuff like bodies, necks, pickups & tailpieces are long gone.

Also, he's slowly becoming more & more inactive with the business, wanting to focus more on family life. There was mention of him selling up last time we spoke. If you still need to cotact him use the phone number on the website & call in the morning. I must've got lucky because he'd always answer. I was in London though. Maybe foreign numbers get ignored.

That Guild replica is incredible, by the way. Amazing work!
You think you can't, you wish you could, I know you can, I wish you would. Slip inside this house as you pass by.

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by epizootics » Tue Jun 11, 2019 1:13 am

Well, just gave them a call and had an answering machine tell me the office was closed 'until the 4th of June'. I'll try again later!

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by mgeek » Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:25 am

DrGonzo wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:58 pm
@mgeek

thanks. i‘ve watched this video more than once. better than the „john 5 plays brian‘s....“ :wacko:
that’s where i found out about the trem block. which is the reason why i‘m thinking about a tele tailpiece. the hammered-in block must make the tone thicker and give more resonance, which then should equal the tele tone. that’s my theory anyway... one part of me wants to make an exact copy, the other part just wants a white teardrop guitar that nails the tone. so i’m not quite sure here.

saldy i don’t really know the cosmetical difference between UK an IT pickups. i‘ve looked at photos of an italian vox and bought pickups that look different. they should arrive any moment now, maybe someone can ID those for me (thanks for that FB link).

so you’re saying Brian‘s must be 25,5 scale lenght?

can you compare the neck profile and thickness to gibson necks? 59ish or more like mid 50s? (fat or really fat..)
C or D shaped?

@epizootics thank you so much...
Hahah yeah I hate when they get some dude to twang tastelessly on an old guitar...just play the thing properly!

It's your project of course, but personally I'd go for the strat bridge with the trem block and Fender pat pending saddles! I've not seen a properly accurate build of the Brian Jones guitar and you've clearly got the skills to do it. A three saddle tele bridge would just look wrong to me.

The Brian Jones one would have been 25.5, I'm pretty sure yes. Probably an ebony fingerboard like the Phantoms of that period too. No idea why but when EKO started making Vox stuff too they changed the scale. The pickups differ internally. The UK ones sound REALLY good, like a great Fender pickup and constructed in a similar manner, slightly hotter, but the Italian ones sound kinda thin and lifeless. If you got some of the square covers (i think phantom guitar works sells these) then probably any good fenderish pickup would work.

UK http://www.vintageguitarandbass.com/vox ... pickup.php

Italian (in a hilariously overpriced ebay listing) https://www.ebay.com/itm/3-MATCHED-60s- ... Swh0NcfGE6

I don't really know anything about Gibson necks but they are a regular fenderish C shape at the nut, and taper quite noticably . You can sort of 'see' the rough shape these were cut to before being hand shaped, and right up by the body they just took the edges off, so the centre of the profile is quite flat. 22mm deep at the nut 24mm at the 7th fret, 25/26 mm at the 15th.

I'd thought they might all be different, but I got another Phantom neck, made for them by a different UK supplier (UK Vox tended to buy the bodies/necks in and just finish and assemble in house), and it was exactly the same

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by DrGonzo » Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:59 am

mgeek wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:25 am
DrGonzo wrote:
Mon Jun 10, 2019 11:58 pm
@mgeek

thanks. i‘ve watched this video more than once. better than the „john 5 plays brian‘s....“ :wacko:
that’s where i found out about the trem block. which is the reason why i‘m thinking about a tele tailpiece. the hammered-in block must make the tone thicker and give more resonance, which then should equal the tele tone. that’s my theory anyway... one part of me wants to make an exact copy, the other part just wants a white teardrop guitar that nails the tone. so i’m not quite sure here.

saldy i don’t really know the cosmetical difference between UK an IT pickups. i‘ve looked at photos of an italian vox and bought pickups that look different. they should arrive any moment now, maybe someone can ID those for me (thanks for that FB link).

so you’re saying Brian‘s must be 25,5 scale lenght?

can you compare the neck profile and thickness to gibson necks? 59ish or more like mid 50s? (fat or really fat..)
C or D shaped?

@epizootics thank you so much...
Hahah yeah I hate when they get some dude to twang tastelessly on an old guitar...just play the thing properly!

It's your project of course, but personally I'd go for the strat bridge with the trem block and Fender pat pending saddles! I've not seen a properly accurate build of the Brian Jones guitar and you've clearly got the skills to do it. A three saddle tele bridge would just look wrong to me.

The Brian Jones one would have been 25.5, I'm pretty sure yes. Probably an ebony fingerboard like the Phantoms of that period too. No idea why but when EKO started making Vox stuff too they changed the scale. The pickups differ internally. The UK ones sound REALLY good, like a great Fender pickup and constructed in a similar manner, slightly hotter, but the Italian ones sound kinda thin and lifeless. If you got some of the square covers (i think phantom guitar works sells these) then probably any good fenderish pickup would work.

UK http://www.vintageguitarandbass.com/vox ... pickup.php

Italian (in a hilariously overpriced ebay listing) https://www.ebay.com/itm/3-MATCHED-60s- ... Swh0NcfGE6

I don't really know anything about Gibson necks but they are a regular fenderish C shape at the nut, and taper quite noticably . You can sort of 'see' the rough shape these were cut to before being hand shaped, and right up by the body they just took the edges off, so the centre of the profile is quite flat. 22mm deep at the nut 24mm at the 7th fret, 25/26 mm at the 15th.

I'd thought they might all be different, but I got another Phantom neck, made for them by a different UK supplier (UK Vox tended to buy the bodies/necks in and just finish and assemble in house), and it was exactly the same
you're probably right about the bridge.. good strat saddles just seem to be pretty damn expensive. a high quality half-tele bridge is just under 40€. the strat trem system (made of the correct materials) is 3-4 times as much.

not sure if you're right about me having the skills tho :) the thunderbird turned out incredible and sounds and plays a million times better than my 3000$ gibson! but hinestly i think was just lucky in many respects. it was my first build..
thinking about routing the (very tight) hole for the trem block gives me the chills!

i wish i posted here before buying the pickups! mine look like the italian plastic things from the back. the wire comes out of one of the holes but they look more or less the same :( so the "good ones" look just like fender PUs.. interesting.. so i basically could buy two new high quality fenders and they could fit into the covers?
Last edited by DrGonzo on Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by DrGonzo » Tue Jun 11, 2019 2:59 am

epizootics wrote:
Tue Jun 11, 2019 1:13 am
Well, just gave them a call and had an answering machine tell me the office was closed 'until the 4th of June'. I'll try again later!
thrilling...

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Re: New Guy building Vox Mk III

Post by DrGonzo » Tue Jun 11, 2019 3:05 am

are the pickups from phantom guitar works any good?

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