New MIJ Mustang - trem questions

[MechaBulletBill]

Sounds great, love the short scale. I'm not a big guy, my fingers aren't that long, and this is much more comfortable for me.

The tremolo has too much movement in it. I haven't taken the plate off yet, but I understand that there are notches to adjust the tremolo stiffness on the posts connecting to the bar (do those screw posts have a name?)

My questions are, what would be the effect of lowering the tremolo bar and why does no one seem to string over the bar rather than under it? I'd have thought tightening everything up and going over the top (maybe with a neck shim to get decent break angle) would be the most stable setup.

[caliban]

Think you would need a huge shim in order to pull the wrapover thing, and the bridge would have to be up rediculously high.

[HNB]

My questions are, what would be the effect of lowering the tremolo bar and why does no one seem to string over the bar rather than under it? I'd have thought tightening everything up and going over the top (maybe with a neck shim to get decent break angle) would be the most stable setup.

Lowering the tremolo bar using the a allen wrench and those two little holes gives it more string break angle and often helps reduce string buzzing. You don't have to take the plate off for that.

Like said above, stringing them over the tube would give you pretty super high action. (Like almost an inch higher than going under.) You would have to put a big shim on it and even without the springs on the pickups, you likely wouldn't be able to get them high enough.

Some people unscrew the tube from the two posts and reverse it so the strings can feed straight through. Maybe that would give you more of an effect you are going for? With it reversed, you could even disable the tremolo completely by replacing the posts with bolts with the correct thread to screw in, or put metal washers between the tube and tremolo place and screw it tight. No more tremolo that way.

[MechaBulletBill]

Oh no, I really want to get the trem working. It's just way too soft for me at the minute. Once I get heavier strings, nut cut, stop the bridge rocking, hopefully it'll stabilise a bit. Is adjusting the springs under the plate the only way to stiffen the trem action?

Also, it sounds really great, but it's very quiet. Noticeably less output than my MIM 60s tele. It can't even trigger the peak light on my RE20 without some boosting. Is that normal?

[HNB]

Maybe the pickups are too far from the strings? You can replace the springs under the plate that connect to the posts. Lowering the tube might help also.

[Danley]

If you want a stiff trem, should have gotten any other guitar One thing I love about the Mustang tremolo is its loose, easy action... And even if you place the springs on the posts for maximum tension and adjust it all the way back... It's still a VERY loose trem. MAYBE you can by chance find stiffer springs that will fit, but I wouldn't know where to start with that. Wonder if Kahler bass springs could be adapted or something?

No clue what alternate string configurations on the cigar would do to that, I'm guessing not much. As for the output, the covers on Mustangs can prevent pickups from adjusting to the "proper" height. I'd switch to something high output.

[caliban]

I found the Mustang I had (Squier one, but updated the pickups to Japanese, sounded pretty much exactly the same), to have rather low output too

[RollingJ]

Have you moved the springs onto the end notches yet? You should do if adding heavier gauge strings.

It has always seemed to me that lowering the bar increases the string tension. If you find the trem too spongy you could always remove the arm and use the trem by resting your palm on the bar. It makes diveboming unlikely, but the Mustang trem was not designed for extreme use anyway.

Last resort: switch out the Japanese made trem for a US original.

[Danley]

Agree that lowering the bar would help but... A US trem will be just as loose. Japanese posts have an additional notch for the spring, so while I believe they have the potential to be set up looser than a US model they'll both be about as tight when set for max. stiffness...

[MechaBulletBill]

It does seem to be settling down the more I play it, holding the tuning better. The low output doesn't bother me (volume comes from pedals/amp, for me).

What I'm kind of struggling with is the grub screw to keep the tremolo arm in place (and to stop it roughing up against the trem plate). I need to go out and get some tape to stop the bridge rock (it just doesn't work for me that way) and when I've got the strings off, I'll see about adjusting the springs underneath the plate.

Is the cigar tube/stoptail bar supposed to be parallel to the body or can it sit at an angle? It seems pretty straight at the minute but the high E and B strings are touching the intonation screws so it's gonna have to move one way or the other.

[Danley]

The cigar doesn't need to be parallel/perpendicular, it's preference.

I made a Mustang setup guide below, if you're dead set on having the trem at a perfect vertical float, and have it stay I. Tune and stable... I'd rather set up a Floyd than a Mustang.

http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/vie ... &p=1302154" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

One way to keep the arm in place: screw the grub screw down tight, rotate the trem arm repeatedly to create a "groove" in it. Repeat multiple times, re-tightening.

[MechaBulletBill]

Yeah, I found that guide. It's very helpful, but the wall of text just confirms that it's gonna be tricky. Still, I reckon once I get the nut worked on and lubed up, everything else will be a matter of tweaking/tuning till it's as good as can be. If I can get it almost as stable as I managed to get the trem on my VMJM *cough*FOR SALE *cough*, that'll be good enough.

[Danley]

Setting Mustangs up can be annoying. Especially as I'm anal about the cigar position. It's the reason I haven't switched string gauges on mine, setting up again is something I don't look forward to.

I do wonder how many aftermarket/stiffer springs might fit.

[andy_tchp]

The best tuning stability I experienced was with the

- Cigar tube cranked down as far as it could go
- Springs on the furthest notches
- Bridge centred in the thimbles and set to rock as it was designed to.

You could do ridiculous dive-bombs with the strings bouncing off the fretboard and it'd come back perfectly every time.

(MG65 Model made in Japan.)

For the swinging tremolo arm/grub screw situation I cut a tiny square of heat-shrink tubing (probably 3mm x 3mm) and dropped it in the hole before screwing the grub screw back in. It provided enough resistance to stop the bar swinging, but not so much resistance that you couldn't move the bar out of the way when you wanted. That fix held up for the 12 months or so I owned the guitar and hadn't slipped at all when I dropped it off for sale on consignment.

Agree with Danley's comments, the trem assembly on these IS nice and soft to use, regardless of how you set it up. A small contributor to that is the 24" scale, too.

[MechaBulletBill]

OK now I have it set up pretty much how I want it but the tailpiece\cigar tube is too angled towards the neck. The whammy bar points down towards the pickguard.

The springs are on the end notches of the posts, but I'm at a loss with how to fix the angle.