AVRI Vibrato issue

[MC3]

Hey everyone.

I feel kinda bad starting another thread on this topic because I've definitely read some posts in the past regarding the same kind of issues on here, but a few things made it weird to me and I figured it was worth asking. I also have almost no technical experience so I figured it was a good idea to consult y'all for help instead of wrongly diagnosing the problem.

I've had a Squier J Mascis JM for a few years now, but I just decided it was time to go to an AVRI vibrato because I was tired of the clunky and rattling squier one. I ordered it and got everything installed along with a Wilkinson bridge. I strung it all up and started playing it. I wanted to see how the vibrato handled, and it was really nice, smooth, and quiet..... until I started doing some heavier stuff. When bending down, after a certain distance, I would get a ping from somewhere behind the bridge on the high e, then the high e would go out of tune nearly a half step. Then after a certain distance bending the arm up, I would get a clunk noise from the vibrato, almost like it was hitting something. I tried to figure out what the issue was, so I kept doing some heavy bending, thinking I had to break the arm in or something, but just the high e was going drastically out of tune, where after one medium to good sized bend it would be a half step out. Eventually, the high e string broke at the ball end.

I had read somewhere on here that the vibratos can sometimes have some defects in the metal on the string holes which leads to friction and such... could that be it? The thing that was weird to me was the pinging, and the fact that the high e would go sooo out of tune after a normal-ish bend.

Any insight is appreciated.... just a kid trying to get his guitar playing well. Thanks!

[adamrobertt]

Sounds like you have a burr in the high e slot on the vibrato plate. Filing the inside should help.

[ek11sx]

My money is on the string not being able to handle the vibrato use. Try using GHS boomers. I had this issue and a strong change helped me out dramatically

[seawalker]

Just a few ideas:

Make sure the part of the vibrato that moves is not touching either side of the slot where it sticks out from. I had one that did that once, and it produced some weird phenomena. You can slacken the strings and move it by hand to get it centered.

Is it possible your strings are touching the back of the bridge when it rocks? This could produce pinging sounds through the amp.

Are the strings touching the domed screws on the vibrato plate when it moves to an extreme position? Those are a problem for some people. The geometry of the Mascis might be different than any JM I'm used to - just something to check.

As for your high E, I've never experienced that problem, but it might be that the hole is not totally smooth and needs to be filed.

Sometimes the issues are actually at the other end, though. I hear pinging sometimes from the nut or string tree when tuning up new strings that goes away over time.

[smalltownsongs]

Sorry to latch on to this a month-ish later...

Also, check your strings. Seriously.
I'd been playing the El Cheapo D'addario 10's on my ECJM.
Same thing would happen on my high E. What's that plink? Wait, why is my string 2 steps lower? Hmmm..
I read an article somewhere by Mike Adams on this exact situation.
I ended up soldering the part just before the ball. Hadn't happened again.

Also switched to D'ad XT's which are already extra reinforced down by the ball end and have not had it happen again.

Worth a shot!

[adamrobertt]

Sorry to latch on to this a month-ish later...

Also, check your strings. Seriously.
I'd been playing the El Cheapo D'addario 10's on my ECJM.
Same thing would happen on my high E. What's that plink? Wait, why is my string 2 steps lower? Hmmm..
I read an article somewhere by Mike Adams on this exact situation.
I ended up soldering the part just before the ball. Hadn't happened again.

Also switched to D'ad XT's which are already extra reinforced down by the ball end and have not had it happen again.

Worth a shot!

Yes, it's come up time and again that the standard D'Addario strings are not strong enough at the ball end for the Fender offset vibrato. I use GHS Boomers and have never had an issue.

[supersonicjazzmaster]

What I do sometimes: I put a tiny drop tin solder onto the string near to the ball end.
So the string can not untwist itself.
I do this especially on Daddario chromes High E strings.

[smalltownsongs]

What I do sometimes: I put a tiny drop tin solder onto the string near to the ball end.
So the string can not untwist itself.
I do this especially on Daddario chromes High E strings.

Yup, exactly

[adamrobertt]

It's much easier (IMO) to just buy strings that don't break. I don't want to break out the GD soldering iron every time I change strings. BUT, to each his own. I know a lot of dudes also do the solder trick.

[andy_tchp]

It's much easier (IMO) to just buy strings that don't break. I don't want to break out the GD soldering iron every time I change strings. BUT, to each his own. I know a lot of dudes also do the solder trick.

Yep it's bizarre, nobody ever wants to change from their beloved D'Addarios.

[smalltownsongs]

It's much easier (IMO) to just buy strings that don't break. I don't want to break out the GD soldering iron every time I change strings. BUT, to each his own. I know a lot of dudes also do the solder trick.

Yep it's bizarre, nobody ever wants to change from their beloved D'Addarios.

It's the nicotine in them.

[jorri]

Yo daddario even sell presoldered strings, as well as product lines like nyxl that don't break.

Is this the next fifteen page thread on the issue mark 63 or something

[Horsefeather]

I started a thread on this string breakage thing a while back and left off in the middle of an experiment that is ongoing.

I'm not at all convinced that burrs in the hole has anything to do with the issue.

My belief is that breakage at the ball end occurs when the two bits of string at the ball are aligned vertically when the string is installed. I think this causes the bottom piece to experience enough stress that it fails. The high E is generally the only one where the string is thin enough for it to happen.

This seems to be a common yet random problem. No one has confirmed cause in all these years. I think the randomness is attributable to the fact that it's related to string installation. Who ever thinks about how the ball is sitting in there?

So I suggest two things: First, make sure you're not getting slippage at the tuner peg. If you happen to have the split "safety" tuners, you can wrap the string once around just a single side of the post before executing another full wrap and then insertion into the hole.

Second, ensure that you install your ball ends so that the string loop is horizontal. In other words, make sure the hole of the ball end is lying flat relative to the guitar body. I bent a nail into a wide U shape and inserted it into the E and B string ends so that they keep each other aligned the way I want and I haven't had another break. Granted, I haven't played the JM much, either. But it's worth a shot.



Finally, I realize your problem may be something else entirely, given the odd noises you're getting. But it might also be a combination of tuning peg slippage and the ball end issue so good luck!

[Mondaysoutar]

The high E breakage, I think that’ll be the domed screw sitting directly underneath it as another poster said man. Raising the bridge normally remedies that. Maybe look into a shim.

The trem clicking, etc. Make sure your tension screw isn’t too tight, that definitely causes spring noise sometimes. Also, I’d take the unit off and lubricate the undersides moving parts. The tailpiece that covers the string end, the spring, the plates, etc. Make sure your collet is secure, and lube the end of the arm a wee bit before putting it into the collet. Make sure the arm is all the way in, and hopefully it’s mission accomplished ha. Try not remove it if you don’t have to either man.

The AVRI trem is class, after you get it ticking you’ll like it man.