Tremolo assembly woes/spring? *EDIT* It's the fulcrum! (string anchor bit)

[misowaki]

Hi all, following on from some questions I'd asked in perhaps the wrong section, I'm bringing my follow ups here.

So basically my tremolo assembly is being a prick. Below are photos which led me to believe the whole thing may be bent or generally kaput.

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1iU9oxa ... sp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1C-qAkZ ... sp=sharing

After taking it apart and putting it back together again about a million times, I've figured that initially the spring was too loose. I'd left it that way so as to be able to adjust but apparently that's not the way to do it because although seemingly fine before tuning it looked buggered as soon as in tune. Then I tightened it loads and lo and behold, fixed! Except for the insanely high tension, limited r.o.m and the creaking/clipping of some part when giving it some. So I loosened it a touch and all good until I gave it a deep push, heard the click of the plate moving and back to square one.

I'm now of the opinion it must be the spring. Could it be that the spring has lost all tension and is knackered hence jumping out under low tension and the need to over tighten? I remember coming across a thread which spoke of different spring tensions. Or should there be something holding the spring in place to keep it from popping out and string tension pulling the plate forward? Or am I just hopeless?

*EDIT* the spring is super strong. Took it apart again and couldn't compress it with fingers alone so can't be that. But every time I tune up, it slips Could I need a looser spring? The only way to stop it popping out is by having the spring so tight that it negates the trem bar so a bend won't even alter the pitch by a semitone.

Any help appreciated, even if it's just pointing out I'm being a twat and missing something obvious.

Thanks!

Andrew

Original thread for anyone interested is here http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/vie ... 0#p1521450

[misowaki]

Anyone with any suggestions? I've got EB Power Slinkys on there atm (so 11s)... but wouldn't have thought that tiny bit of extra tension would cause the string anchor (which is what I've decided it's called) to pull so tightly towards the bridge.

[misowaki]

Another convo with myself, this is fun.

Lighter strings, same difference. Any tension causes the plate to sink beneath the gap so the strings rub on the screw and trem setup is rendered useless/impossible. It's either spring way too tight to keep the plate up or too loose to let the whole thing sink.

Have ordered a new trem assembly but a month's wait on it, so that's also fun.

[oid]

This is not the fastest board, and the service is free, so complaining about not getting responses is not a good way to get attention.

Something is off inside, could be the part of the trem that the strings are on, the trem itself, is damaged or bent. Could the the fulcrum, the part that is held on by the 3 screws just in front of the strings, is damaged or bent. Would need to see photos of the inside to know.

[misowaki]

Not complaining, just frustrating seeing 86 people have read but no one can offer advice on a specialist forum and I find it hard to believe I'm the only one to have experienced this. Also I just want to be able to play my JM without worrying. Can't blame me for that, right?

Anyway, having taken it apart again it looks like the fulcrum is fucked, but I didn't know it was called that until I read your message so thanks for that. The crease in the... let's call them feet, is on a diagonal so the high 'e' end is shorter and it widens slightly with an odd indentation as it reaches the low 'e'. At first I thought it was design but thinking on it, there's no reason for it to be anything but straight as it wants to hold the rest of the assembly in position and has no need to compensate for anything as intonation and action is on the bridge and not the fulcrum itself.

I have an AVRI trem unit arriving tomorrow. Seems of the two in the whole of the UK that came into stock today, I was able to nab one so hopefully that's problem solved.

[misowaki]

Should anyone care, it's the fulcrum. Take a looky here...

https://drive.google.com/file/d/14uf6Gx ... sp=sharing
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1x4ed2r ... sp=sharing

Notice how one side touches and is in position where the other just dangles mid air. This must have been what cause the downward pull on the high 'e' side and kept low 'E' in place. I also came across a guitar tech blog who said he fixed an issue be filing it down so that will be what I do.

AVRI assembly arrived, it's now perfect because the fulcrum is perfect. Gonna attempt the filing on CIJ to match just to see if it is fixable for anyone else who may be experiencing the same. Save yourself £100.

[MattK]

Nice work - I think you'll find the AVRI trem is quite a bit nicer in operation overall even with the fulcrum on the CIJ fixed.
One reason you might not have had answers to the first post is that the images aren't visible and the links don't work either, so it wasn't possible to see the problem you described. Unless you edited it afterward, for whatever reason that sometimes breaks links.
And welcome to the forum, we're usually quite a chatty bunch but threads get a LOT of views before people chime in. Happens to me often. Might even be bots / crawlers from the search engines.

[misowaki]

Thanks man, links used to work, pretty sure they did initially as I got a reply but I'll link them again for prosperity. I think it may have been an edit that screwed it.
Anyway, here are all the pics. Will add some of the actual fulcrum when I can be arsed to take it apart again. Right now I'm sick of the constant disassemble/assemble process

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1x4ed2 ... xSXCBb1nJC
https://drive.google.com/open?id=14uf6G ... N9N7cSFgRm
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1C-qAk ... vLXt-iFmf3
https://drive.google.com/open?id=1iU9ox ... 0baayzds9f

[timtam]

AVRI assembly arrived, it's now perfect because the fulcrum is perfect. Gonna attempt the filing on CIJ to match just to see if it is fixable for anyone else who may be experiencing the same. Save yourself £100.

Suggest you read this before attempting to file. While some have suggested a rounded edge might work, the fulcrum edge design most consistent with the trems that seem to work best is a single contact point, 'knife edge', slanted-end edge (not a 'squared' end, which creates two possible edges which the contact point can move between) ...
http://www.offsetguitars.com/forums/vie ... =7&t=95426

[misowaki]

Ah nice one! Thanks for the tip!

[Gevalt]

I had one where the three screws were too long