Game of Thrones Custom Shop Fender Jaguar (House Lannister)

[NickD]

Look, any time Tom Morello mugs to sell a $30,000 strat, someone should remind him he's a Marxist.

And then remind him that as an honors polysci student at Harvard, he should know better.

He did have the look of someone who was selling themselves out.

‘Fuck you I won’t do what you tell me’ indeed.

[wooderson]

Look, any time Tom Morello mugs to sell a $30,000 strat, someone should remind him he's a Marxist.

And then remind him that as an honors polysci student at Harvard, he should know better.

If you really wanted to run with that tiresome joke, appearing in a video with these (absolutely hideous) guitars built by well-paid artisans is more politically appropriate for him than a video for an assembly-line guitar. Alienation of labor, etc..

[mackerelmint]

Nah, he's got the hat trick right here, shilling for Fender, HBO, and whoever Martin's publisher is all at once. If he were gonna stand on principle and consider alienation of labor, he'd be talking up Doug Kauer's guitars.

Morello's just a posturing rock star. Which would be fine, if he weren't being a hypocrite. I'm not sure what the "tired joke" is supposed to be. He goes to a lot of effort to remind people of his supposed principles, maybe so they don't notice he never seems to follow through on them. If he wants to be a marxist, he should, like, be one.

[shadowplay]

Look, any time Tom Morello mugs to sell a $30,000 strat, someone should remind him he's a Marxist.

And then remind him that as an honors polysci student at Harvard, he should know better.

He did have the look of someone who was selling themselves out.

‘Fuck you I won’t do what you tell me’ indeed.

I barely know who he is beyond breaching my lifetime RATM allowance ten seconds into their well known tune but I could feel the shame and alluded to it earlier.

Shame of Thrones...Game or shames.

Fender's cross marketing is universally awful, remember those Fender VW's? I'm still mildly disturbed how well they went down on here I can only imagine the fevered OSG scenes if Fender went really wild and did a Toyota StratoCamry or pulled on the action sandals and dreamed a Subaru Crossocaster.

D

[offkeyericdee]

I'm not sure if it's a good thing it was a total sausagefest or not, I'm hoping the lack of gender diversity was just down to refusal, though being game of thrones they could just have got a coupla half naked chicks to cavort in the background while the menfolk swung their axes.

Half-naked? Pfff. This is Game of Thrones - it ain't workin' if there's a merkin.

[wooderson]

Nah, he's got the hat trick right here, shilling for Fender, HBO, and whoever Martin's publisher is all at once. If he were gonna stand on principle and consider alienation of labor, he'd be talking up Doug Kauer's guitars.

If we're going down this stupid route, why would it be more appropriate for a Marxist appear in videos promoting a capitalist member of the petit bourgeois?

Youtube itself is owned by a multinational corporation, of course, as are the cameras used to shoot it. And the car that he drove to get there. Presumably, Morello should not involve himself with any of those, being an anti-capitalist himself.

Appearing in a video for guitars created by 'a company' isn't an abrogation of Marxist principles. Guess what, we live in a capitalist society. It is unavoidable - and it is literally impossible to live outside of that hegemonic system.

Morello's just a posturing rock star. Which would be fine, if he weren't being a hypocrite. I'm not sure what the "tired joke" is supposed to be. He goes to a lot of effort to remind people of his supposed principles, maybe so they don't notice he never seems to follow through on them. If he wants to be a marxist, he should, like, be one.

[mackerelmint]

If we're going down this stupid route

You're the one who jumped on MY head here, dude. I just pointed out the hypocrisy of a guy whose stated values and observable behavior are complete opposites and I'm maintaining my position.

Appearing in a video for guitars created by 'a company' isn't an abrogation of Marxist principles. Guess what, we live in a capitalist society. It is unavoidable - and it is literally impossible to live outside of that hegemonic system.

(cute comic deleted)

Yeah, no shit, huh? Of course we have to live in the world we have.

There's a big difference between living in a social order one doesn't agree with because one's gotta eat and participating in that system at a higher than average level while talking out of the other side of one's mouth on a platform the participation in said system has provided. I can't even imagine why any of what I've said bothers you. Unless you just really like Tom Morello. Well, I think he's a phony. Not participating in marketing for a juggernaut franchise product being sold on a basis of price discrimination is a prerequisite for being Marxist, I think most would agree.

[thenewromance]

What, no Tyrion ukulele?

Okay that was funny.

[wooderson]

You're the one who jumped on MY head here, dude. I just pointed out the hypocrisy of a guy whose stated values and observable behavior are complete opposites and I'm maintaining my position.

Yes, and your position is wrong. There is nothing "hypocritical" or "completely opposite" about Morello appearing in a video for Fender any more than in his band being signed to a major label or selling CDs at Best Buy.

I don't care about RATM or Morello in particular but this line is a tiresome strawman that gets dragged out for every anti-capitalist artist from RATM to Billy Bragg to Propaghandi.

Not participating in marketing for a juggernaut franchise product being sold on a basis of price discrimination is a prerequisite for being Marxist, I think most would agree.

Why? What do you think Marxist means? (It's certainly far from a work of activism but it's a goofy video that didn't perpetuate any kind of harm.)

You said earlier that if he was doing this with an 'indie' builder it wouldn't be hypocritical - Doug Kauer is a business owner and an employer, just like FMIC - why would that make it okay? If the working conditions of the people who built these are irrelevant (as you replied to my comment re: the role of Master Builders) then Kauer being a small-timer should also be irrelevant.

[mackerelmint]

You're the one who jumped on MY head here, dude. I just pointed out the hypocrisy of a guy whose stated values and observable behavior are complete opposites and I'm maintaining my position.

Yes, and your position is wrong. There is nothing "hypocritical" or "completely opposite" about Morello appearing in a video for Fender any more than in his band being signed to a major label or selling CDs at Best Buy.

*cough cough* That's it right there, but we could add sponsorships and advertising he's done prior. I guess we just have to disagree here.

I don't care about RATM or Morello in particular but this line is a tiresome strawman that gets dragged out for every anti-capitalist artist from RATM to Billy Bragg to Propaghandi.

What do you think Marxist means? (It's certainly far from a work of activism but it's a goofy video that didn't perpetuate any kind of harm.)

At the very least, it means not lending your likeness to the kinds of companies you posture against to help them sell merchandise and their intangible brand. Or one could say that I think it disqualifies one from truthfully claiming to be a Marxist or fairly opens them up to criticism from anyone who's read Marx on the basis of hypocrisy. As for what I think a "Marxist" is, does it matter? There are a zillion self-described marxists out there who believe all kinds of things. As far as I can tell the only thing they all have in common is holding the idea of capitalism static while they duck around the many failures of Marx's premises either through updated new ones or simply denying reality and attacking the apostates. And steadfast belief in state control of all physical capital as well as not helping large private firms from a top-down position.

You said earlier that if he was doing this with an 'indie' builder it wouldn't be hypocritical - Doug Kauer is a business owner and an employer, just like FMIC - why would that make it okay? If the working conditions of the people who built these are irrelevant (as you replied to my comment re: the role of Master Builders) then Kauer being a small-timer should also be irrelevant.

I'll just quote you here:

appearing in a video with these (absolutely hideous) guitars built by well-paid artisans is more politically appropriate for him than a video for an assembly-line guitar. Alienation of labor, etc..

Well, I brought up Doug because he owns his means of production and while I didn't specifically bring up the working conditions of anyone, Doug works in the same conditions as his employees and there's a whole hell of a lot less income disparity happening there. That isn't at all the case at Fender, who have operations all over the world to build instruments to all kinds of price points with differing conditions and levels of alienation evidenced. And you're correct that I alluded to working conditions, but how can you say that I called or even suggested they were irrelevant? My position is the opposite of what you're claiming, and you're grumpy because you think you see me making a straw man argument? Sir, your assertion that I claimed working conditions irrelevant is the literal definition of a straw man argument.

Doug's a guy with a shop and a little help making things at the top of the market. Fender custom shop is also making things at the top of the market. It's around 10K for a custom shop instrument, I think. Doug sells for way less, and it all just goes to alienation of labor, doesn't it? Fender takes a much larger profit for a comparable instrument. In the case of these ones, the added labor of programming a CNC and finishing the instrument in a bit more detail does not triple the labor inputs... and since we have to adhere to labor value theory to keep this restricted to marxist terms, the additional cost of production is irrelevant. Yet these guitars cost triple what another CS fender does. Gosh! So that money just goes to the haute bourgeoisie while Morello sits there with a grin on his face, furthering the brand of a privately held multinational. And even if one rejects the idea that he's up there "selling", so what?

And before I go, I'd like to just say that you opened this debate by describing my criticism as a "tiresome joke" and just keep moaning about how tedious you find this argument you admit to having picked and keep furthering. Like a putz. I'm not interested in a bloodsport argument over something like this with someone who acts put upon for having started it. Good lord.

[wooderson]

As far as I can tell the only thing they all have in common is holding the idea of capitalism static while they duck around the many failures of Marx's premises either through updated new ones or simply denying reality and attacking the apostates. And steadfast belief in state control of all physical capital as well as not helping large private firms from a top-down position.

The crux of the issue - it's a tiresome joke that doesn't have anything to do with Morello or the video, it's about whatever bone you have to pick with a big, vague bogeyman called "Marxism."

Well, I brought up Doug because he owns his means of production and while I didn't specifically bring up the working conditions of anyone, Doug works in the same conditions as his employees and there's a whole hell of a lot less income disparity happening there.

You're begging all sorts of questions there but regardless: Kauer is as much a capitalist as the people of FMIC, just less financially successful. He's not running a collective, he employs people beneath him.

If it's wrong for Morello to do promos for capitalist entities, as you're arguing, it's wrong whether that's Fender or Kauer.

And you're correct that I alluded to working conditions, but how can you say that I called or even suggested they were irrelevant? My position is the opposite of what you're claiming, and you're grumpy because you think you see me making a straw man argument?

You're confused - I referred to working conditions and a theoretical difference in promo-ing guitars made by well-paid artisans and assembly line guitars. You hand-waved that difference away, anything to do with Fender is the same because they're a corporation.

You then brought up Kauer. If the size of the capitalist entity - small indie shop vs big multinational - would make it okay for Morello to do a promo, I'm not sure why the working conditions of Custom Shop Master Builders like Ron Thorn wouldn't do much the same. It's clearly not just an up/down question of 'capitalism good/bad' if Kauer is acceptable.

[higgsblossom]

Whataboutism doesn’t make this guitar any better...

[Arthon]

So ugly, it makes me want to drink a whole bottle of Scotch...

https://www.thedrinksbusiness.com/2019/ ... ollection/

[Zork]

What, no Tyrion ukulele?

made my day!

[sirspens]

I don't like this air,
But that doesn't mean I'll stop breathing it