Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Discussion of vintage Jazzmasters, Jaguars, Bass VIs, Electric XIIs and any other offset-waist instruments.
User avatar
señormisterioso
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 83
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2019 6:35 am

Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by señormisterioso » Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:46 am

I was wondering if you guys have seen or owned examples of custom colors without the white / mint guard.
Was that usual too? Was it a costumer specification option or something that some people did after purchase.

I've seen one in the past, but I thought the Tortoise Shell made it a potential refin.

User avatar
adamrobertt
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1529
Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2010 10:28 am
Contact:

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by adamrobertt » Fri Jun 19, 2020 6:36 am

I wouldn't trust that a tort guard on a custom color is original unless there was some kind of proof that it was. It would be smart to always assume it's a refin.

User avatar
zhivago
Mods
Mods
Posts: 20723
Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2006 6:18 am
Location: London, UK

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by zhivago » Fri Jun 19, 2020 6:50 am

I would only trust Blonde or Olympic White personally.

It is possible that the odd guitar slipped out with tort and a different Custom Colour, after all Fender made thousands upon thousands of these guitars...but I wouldn't have the stomach to put my credit card on the table for a guitar like that.

The longer the tale, the harder the sale. :)
Resident Spartan.

User avatar
adamrobertt
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1529
Joined: Sun Mar 28, 2010 10:28 am
Contact:

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by adamrobertt » Fri Jun 19, 2020 8:48 am

zhivago wrote:
Fri Jun 19, 2020 6:50 am
I would only trust Blonde or Olympic White personally.

It is possible that the odd guitar slipped out with tort and a different Custom Colour, after all Fender made thousands upon thousands of these guitars...but I wouldn't have the stomach to put my credit card on the table for a guitar like that.

The longer the tale, the harder the sale. :)
Yes of course those are exceptions because they came with tort. But yes, I like that take.

User avatar
Jazzmastervsjaguar
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 714
Joined: Mon May 28, 2012 7:37 am
Location: Washington DC
Contact:

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by Jazzmastervsjaguar » Fri Jun 19, 2020 9:21 am

This is something I've always wondered about myself. I agree that if there are true examples they would have to be far and few between that being said take a look at the BMM jag on this old Fender manual:

Image

Obviously OW and Blonde aside I would assume re-fin if I saw a custom color with tort but seeing that Fender has made these (or at least one for sure) I would assume that there must be more out there.

User avatar
reserves
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 56
Joined: Wed Jul 24, 2013 9:33 am

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by reserves » Fri Jun 19, 2020 1:43 pm

Seem to remember a Fiesta Red JM with Tortoise Pick Guard advertised as original At some point, but could have that wrong.

User avatar
reserves
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 56
Joined: Wed Jul 24, 2013 9:33 am

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by reserves » Fri Jun 19, 2020 1:43 pm

Seem to remember a Fiesta Red JM with Tortoise Pick Guard advertised as original At some point, but could have that wrong.

User avatar
bterry
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1296
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 8:53 am

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by bterry » Fri Jun 19, 2020 5:50 pm

It’s 100% possible to have an original custom color Jazzmaster pre mid-1962 with a tortoise guard. Pre mid-1961 it’s even 50/50, I would say.

Post mid-1962 it becomes rarer and more rare as time goes on but remember that dealers and customers could order any combo they wanted.

As was mentioned above sunburst, Oly White and blond were typically tortoise BUT I’ve seen two original examples of Oly White with mint guards and 3 examples of sunburst with mint guards, all 100% original.

I’ve seen a handful of pre 1962 JMs in custom colors with tort guards that were 100% and some are even owned/have been owned by fellow OSG forumites ;)

User avatar
surfin_bird
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1144
Joined: Fri Jan 08, 2010 11:06 am
Location: Amsterdam

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by surfin_bird » Mon Jun 22, 2020 11:09 pm

Isn’t it true that selmer repainted a whole bunch of sunburst offsets fiesta red after the paint flaked off on its way to europe. I guess that makes it non original, but still from the same time frame.

User avatar
bterry
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1296
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 8:53 am

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by bterry » Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:18 am

They did, after Hank Marvin’s success in the UK and owning to his 1959 Fiesta Red Strat.

It wasn’t because the guitars sent over had paint issues, it was because they were sunburst. Fender couldn’t keep up with the volume of red custom orders so they sent SB models that were then repainted/painted over.

Those were mostly Strats, however...I’ve seen a few Bass VIs as well but I don’t think this happened quite as much with Jazzmasters. Anyway, I know of two original 1961 Fiesta Red Jazzmasters w/ tort guards here in the states.

User avatar
fuzzjunkie
Expat
Expat
Posts: 4639
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:32 am
Location: Seattle

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by fuzzjunkie » Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:59 am

Fiesta Red does seem to be the most popular color for this scenario. I have seen a number of Olympic Whites and one Blonde.

The only original custom color Fender guitars that I have personally seen that had tortoise shell pick guards that were not Olympics were 2 Fiesta Red pre-1962 Jazzmasters, a 1962 Black Jazzmaster, and a Sherwood Green 1961 Jazzmaster that's owned by a close friend. He’s had it since the early 90s.

-None had matching headstocks, which is also a pre-1962 trait.

All the custom color Jaguars that I have seen that had tortoise pick guards were refinished. A 1963 Surf Green Jaguar that I owned. A 1963 Burgundy Mist, and several Fiesta Reds and Black Jaguars.

-All of the Jaguars had matching headstocks.

There was a member here with a beautiful Daphne blue Jazzmaster that had a tort guard and unmatched headstock that I believe he said was an original 1961 model. I own it’s cousin from 1963 that had a tort guard that I replaced with mint. The guard was original, but the Daphne blue and a Mustang bridge aren’t.

User avatar
bterry
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 1296
Joined: Sun Oct 11, 2009 8:53 am

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by bterry » Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:58 pm

fuzzjunkie wrote:
Tue Jun 23, 2020 7:59 am
Fiesta Red does seem to be the most popular color for this scenario. I have seen a number of Olympic Whites and one Blonde.

The only original custom color Fender guitars that I have personally seen that had tortoise shell pick guards that were not Olympics were 2 Fiesta Red pre-1962 Jazzmasters, a 1962 Black Jazzmaster, and a Sherwood Green 1961 Jazzmaster that's owned by a close friend. He’s had it since the early 90s.

-None had matching headstocks, which is also a pre-1962 trait.

All the custom color Jaguars that I have seen that had tortoise pick guards were refinished. A 1963 Surf Green Jaguar that I owned. A 1963 Burgundy Mist, and several Fiesta Reds and Black Jaguars.

-All of the Jaguars had matching headstocks.

There was a member here with a beautiful Daphne blue Jazzmaster that had a tort guard and unmatched headstock that I believe he said was an original 1961 model. I own it’s cousin from 1963 that had a tort guard that I replaced with mint. The guard was original, but the Daphne blue and a Mustang bridge aren’t.
Nice! Sherwood Green is so rare, lovely color.

That Daphne is a ‘62 veneer board version I believe and the forum member still has it as far as I know, really beautiful Jazzmaster, indeed.

User avatar
fuzzjunkie
Expat
Expat
Posts: 4639
Joined: Thu Oct 12, 2006 11:32 am
Location: Seattle

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by fuzzjunkie » Wed Jun 24, 2020 7:04 am

The tortoise shell guard on mine was cracked in 2 places and I wasn’t a big fan of the look on a blue guitar. I prefer the mint look on Daphne.

Image

User avatar
zhivago
Mods
Mods
Posts: 20723
Joined: Tue Sep 12, 2006 6:18 am
Location: London, UK

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by zhivago » Wed Jun 24, 2020 1:06 pm

fuzzjunkie wrote:
Wed Jun 24, 2020 7:04 am
The tortoise shell guard on mine was cracked in 2 places and I wasn’t a big fan of the look on a blue guitar. I prefer the mint look on Daphne.

Image
:?
Resident Spartan.

User avatar
blacktiger
PAT. # 2.972.923
PAT. # 2.972.923
Posts: 3928
Joined: Sun Nov 12, 2006 7:05 pm
Location: banned in DC

Re: Custom Color with Tortoise Shell Pickguard

Post by blacktiger » Fri Jun 26, 2020 10:28 pm

Image
my vinyl weighs a ton

Post Reply