Vintage or custom shop?

Discussion of vintage Jazzmasters, Jaguars, Bass VIs, Electric XIIs and any other offset-waist instruments.
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Embenny
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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by Embenny » Mon Jul 16, 2018 10:33 am

To me, if you want the vintage specs, just go vintage. As was said, why go for the high end imitation of vintage if the price is close (and resale is way lower)? I know, I know, we all buy guitars without planning to sell, but if you're plunking down thousands and thousands of dollars for a guitar, why not make the choice that looks to remain stable or appreciate rather than drop 40% when you drive it off the lot?

If you want a variation on specs - radius, neck size or carve, creative pickups, flashy non vintage colored paint job etc - then the CS can't be beat (unless you're looking at a danocaster, but that's not answering the OP's question directly).

Even if you want a fun colour, grab a stripped or refinned vintage one and go to town. You're not devaluing by painting it neon yellow or whatever you want.

I have both original and refinned vintage offsets and for the money, I wouldn't do anything else. I do new builds/partscasters for when I want funky specs.
The artist formerly known as mbene085.

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by gringopig » Mon Jul 16, 2018 10:36 am

I'm looking at something at the moment. maybe the seller is even a member lol

It's a ####### Jaguar with # neck width in a lovely sunburst. God it's awesome. I want it really badly. If your here Mr johnnie_kim, sell it to me!!

PLEASE
:-)
Last edited by gringopig on Mon Jul 16, 2018 12:03 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by gringopig » Mon Jul 16, 2018 12:02 pm

The deed is done!!

Preliminary pics from seller:

Image

Any guesses?

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by bencrit » Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:16 pm

That looks vintage to me. An early 62 unless my eyes fool me.

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by gringopig » Mon Jul 16, 2018 2:29 pm

Aha the eye of the expert! Spot on.

Have to travel to pick it up and will post pics...

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by mcatano » Wed Jul 18, 2018 11:09 am

Late to this conversation, as the OP has found a rad guitar, but I'd just like to air my grievance over fender's inexplicable choice of incredibly chintzy-looking faux-tort on CS guitars. The pickguards look very, very bad.

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by gringopig » Wed Jul 18, 2018 1:42 pm

So thanks all for your input on this. I went with the sentiment that windmill expressed:
"Once the vintage gas bug bites it doesn't go away.

The only cure is to buy a vintage piece."

and I bought a 1962 jaguar from a lovely chap in York who seems to have been bitten by the same bug except the one that bit him was MUCH bigger. Possibly the size of a small bear.

Image

Image

Image

Came with original case and I feel I was lucky to get it as the Ebay advert went on at 10am whilst I was at work and I was extremely keen to get home, hoping it was still for sale. Good for me that I didn't have to go through a CITES nightmare buying from the United States!
It sounds great. Frets are quite low so it might get refretted but I have no problem with that. I had a refret to my 1974/5 Gibson ES-335 that brought the guitar back to life.
Very happy!

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by canuck » Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:10 am

it really is incredibly hit or miss. i've gone through a ton of vintage guitars over the past few years-- jazzy's and jag's included-- and concluded that most were dogs. just shitty instruments. i don't believe in keeping something around just 'cause it looks cool or earns me brownie points with fellow gearheads. i actually play this shit- record with it, play out, etc.- and so need it to be an incredible instrument if it's gonna stay around. you know, play good, sound good... none of my vintage guitars thus far... all of which were "golden era" 50's and 60's ones... played good or sounded very good, save for maybe one- and even that one wasn't any better than a nice new guitar. i don't think most people will admit it, but a lot of us buy with our eyes and egos... i've had some honest talks with others that've shared the same experience, and it was enlightening to know i'm not the only one feeling this way.

on the other hand, majority of custom shop instruments i've played have been great. they are much more consistently well made. my #1 guitar, over even the $20-30k guitars i've owned, is a $2k '06 custom shop tele that's not only bested any of the guitars i've owned, but any guitar i've ever played. of course it's a highly subjective thing, but if all the offers i've received on it are any indication, i can't be too far off in my assessment. it's just incredibly resonant and lively, super light, with a perfect neck, incredible pickups, etc. 100% bone stock. i walk into my local shop weekly and mess around on their custom shop guitars-- a few of which are some cool jaguars-- and am always blown away by how great they are- much better than the best vintage i've personally played.

but that said, i'm a stupid romantic and keep searching for that perfect vintage axe. just see my thread which i made earlier about wanting to find an old jazzy for a recording project. objectively i know it to be true that i likely won't find anything better than a good contemporary example, but i'll be damned if i don't try to...

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by gringopig » Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:09 am

It's a minefield. We guitarists are easily swayed by artifices which offer the promise of some mythical tone. We all have to accept that.
I have custom shop guitars that are just fantastic; one of which I had no intention to buy until I played a root position Am7 chord after lifting it off the wall at the shop. I swear I saw a small shower of stardust fall from the body as I pulled it towards me.
<<attention: may be made up pish for humour purposes>>

I have very rarely played a bad Fender Custom Shop guitar.

However, when the bug bites, you remain bitten. You admit it too! It's not being a 'stupid romantic', it's the lore of ROCK!
Isn't this why relic guitars are so popular and sell so well? Isn't it why the best selling instruments are still based on the designs of the 1960's and '70's?

If you can get a relic that isn't but actually the real thing and it plays as well as a reproduction then that has to be a good thing. A small salve on the bite.

It's a minefield too: fakes, crappy sounding instruments at inflated prices, good instruments that happen to have become accidentally way more valuable and so on.

Good luck with your search!

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by eggwheat » Thu Jul 19, 2018 10:39 am

I’d always go for original vintage rather than a copy if you can afford it.

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by HNB » Thu Jul 19, 2018 12:20 pm

I would buy Danocaster. Feels like an old guitar, but consistently well made and can get pretty much any color combo and such you want. I had a few vintage Fenders and they were ok. My Dano kills them all and they are long gone now.
Christopher
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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by Jaguar018 » Mon Jul 23, 2018 6:51 am

Mechanical Birds wrote:
Sun Jul 15, 2018 10:45 pm
The only custom shop job I’ve ever seen and gone completely nuts over is that poster (I can’t remember who it was!) with the dark Sherwood ‘66 Jag with the tort guard. That guitar is totally incredible and probably worth whatever he paid. Unless ES that thing, I say go for the source material and get a “real” one.
I think this is me, though I've replaced the tort pickguard. 8)

My experience is with vintage partscasters, vintage refins, AVRI and Custom Shop Jaguars. Not teles or strats, and though I had a few Jazzmasters, I am all about Jaguars. Fender Jaguars, as we all know-- or should know-- aren't exactly pumped out of the Fender Custom Shop at the same pace as their other main guitars.

I still have the Custom Shop Jaguar. It's because it was built to my exact specs-- so take that with a grain of salt. If you don't care about finish colors, or you love sunburst finishes getting a vintage guitar would probably be the smart move-- but if you want a specific color or option like I did, Custom Shop fit the bill.

Some of the vintage examples I played had some great pickups-- but that was hit or miss. Overall, I like having a unique guitar that came from the factory just the way I wanted it.

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by Arthon » Mon Jul 23, 2018 7:20 am

canuck wrote:
Thu Jul 19, 2018 7:10 am
it really is incredibly hit or miss. i've gone through a ton of vintage guitars over the past few years-- jazzy's and jag's included-- and concluded that most were dogs. just shitty instruments. i don't believe in keeping something around just 'cause it looks cool or earns me brownie points with fellow gearheads. i actually play this shit- record with it, play out, etc.- and so need it to be an incredible instrument if it's gonna stay around. you know, play good, sound good... none of my vintage guitars thus far... all of which were "golden era" 50's and 60's ones... played good or sounded very good, save for maybe one- and even that one wasn't any better than a nice new guitar. i don't think most people will admit it, but a lot of us buy with our eyes and egos... i've had some honest talks with others that've shared the same experience, and it was enlightening to know i'm not the only one feeling this way.

on the other hand, majority of custom shop instruments i've played have been great. they are much more consistently well made. my #1 guitar, over even the $20-30k guitars i've owned, is a $2k '06 custom shop tele that's not only bested any of the guitars i've owned, but any guitar i've ever played. of course it's a highly subjective thing, but if all the offers i've received on it are any indication, i can't be too far off in my assessment. it's just incredibly resonant and lively, super light, with a perfect neck, incredible pickups, etc. 100% bone stock. i walk into my local shop weekly and mess around on their custom shop guitars-- a few of which are some cool jaguars-- and am always blown away by how great they are- much better than the best vintage i've personally played.

but that said, i'm a stupid romantic and keep searching for that perfect vintage axe. just see my thread which i made earlier about wanting to find an old jazzy for a recording project. objectively i know it to be true that i likely won't find anything better than a good contemporary example, but i'll be damned if i don't try to...
You explained it better then me...
The Blues Cartographer
(sorry for the spelling, I speak french)

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by Mechanical Birds » Mon Jul 23, 2018 1:40 pm

Jaguar018 wrote:
Mon Jul 23, 2018 6:51 am
Mechanical Birds wrote:
Sun Jul 15, 2018 10:45 pm
The only custom shop job I’ve ever seen and gone completely nuts over is that poster (I can’t remember who it was!) with the dark Sherwood ‘66 Jag with the tort guard. That guitar is totally incredible and probably worth whatever he paid. Unless ES that thing, I say go for the source material and get a “real” one.
I think this is me, though I've replaced the tort pickguard. 8)

My experience is with vintage partscasters, vintage refins, AVRI and Custom Shop Jaguars. Not teles or strats, and though I had a few Jazzmasters, I am all about Jaguars. Fender Jaguars, as we all know-- or should know-- aren't exactly pumped out of the Fender Custom Shop at the same pace as their other main guitars.

I still have the Custom Shop Jaguar. It's because it was built to my exact specs-- so take that with a grain of salt. If you don't care about finish colors, or you love sunburst finishes getting a vintage guitar would probably be the smart move-- but if you want a specific color or option like I did, Custom Shop fit the bill.

Some of the vintage examples I played had some great pickups-- but that was hit or miss. Overall, I like having a unique guitar that came from the factory just the way I wanted it.

Hey Jaguar018

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Re: Vintage or custom shop?

Post by bterry » Tue Jul 24, 2018 10:04 pm

beauty! slab board?

A few (random) things to consider...

If you want vintage specs (radius, frets) it is still better to find a great vintage offset vs custom shop, IME.

If you want modern specs, consider a used custom shop or clean refin you can mod.

Newer guitars are more consistent in terms of playability, but, there are still many original offsets in clean, great playing condition that are just better sounding than the new ones and they are close enough in price that it’s worth the hunt.

By far, the most important thing is how you get along with the neck and pickups of whatever guitar you choose, regardless of the year in which it was made.

I think it goes w/o saying, but, if you put $5k into a clean vintage offset or $5k into a brand new custom shop, the value is heavily in favor of the vintage guitar. Supply vs demand and all that...the CS guitar will loose half its value immediately.

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