'63 Jazzmaster -- your appraisal, please, OSG

[PF_Flyer]

Ah, gotcha. Good eye.

[andrewaward]

The Jazzmaster in the OPs pics looks like a refin........neckpocket doesn't look right.....the burst isn't right, no tan line under pickguard.........not sure if its being sold as a refin?

[Marc]

The guitar at https://imgur.com/a/BKggb looks 100% legit - almost exactly how my slightly later '64 was.

[andrewaward]

neck pocket isn't right Marc .........and the red of the burst doesn't look right.

Before I saw the neckpocket I still thought it was a refin. IMO of course.

[andrewaward]

those bridge thimbles have been out also

[lnwt]

those bridge thimbles have been out also

@andrewaward thanks for the perspective.

How can you tell the pins have been out? What makes the neck pocket say 'refin' to you?

I love this guitar, but wondering now if I need to get it professionally valued for accurate insurance. Unlikely to sell it, whether it's all original or not.

[Embenny]

those bridge thimbles have been out also

@andrewaward thanks for the perspective.

How can you tell the pins have been out? What makes the neck pocket say 'refin' to you?

I love this guitar, but wondering now if I need to get it professionally valued for accurate insurance. Unlikely to sell it, whether it's all original or not.

Whoah, that's a 5-year follow up!

Glad you love the guitar. I can't speak for Andrew, but looking at the photos I see exactly what he means.

The neck pocket looks wrong because the top of the pocket on the left side has black paint on it. Fender attached a paint stick to the two left neck pocket screws during this era during painting, so the black paint should only be on the right side, with a void on the left. This doesn't necessarily mean it's a full refin, but I'd suspect that someone at least oversprayed some black on the burst at some point to "refresh" it.

The reason he can tell the thimbles have been out (or attempted to be taken out) is because of the circular tool marks around them from someone grabbing them with a pair of plier or a wrench and twisting.

[JSett]

I concur. Between the marks around the thimbles and the paint in the pocket this definitely screams refin

[lnwt]

This is all good to know, so much appreciated!

And appears not to change the value as much as I was expecting, which of course is a little beside the point.

How do you differentiate between a factory refin and an aftermarket one?

[Embenny]

How do you differentiate between a factory refin and an aftermarket one?

Two things, basically. #1 is numbers stamped or etched under the pickguard and on the heel of the neck. #2 is provenance. The burden of proof for a factory refin is on the current owner. If no provenance was handed down, it can't safely be assumed to be a factory job. If no numbers are stamped, it has to be assumed to be non-factory.

Also, since it's sunburst, the only reason to refinish it as sunburst would be finish damage, and Fender stopped spraying nitro in '68. So if the guitar is a '63 and is nitro, they'd have had to ruin the finish within 5years to have a chance at a factory nitro respray. You'd also need the factory job to be during an era when the weren't using paint sticks, and to my knowledge, that wouldn't be from '65-'68.

So basically, I don't think this could possibly be a factory job if it's nitro.

[lnwt]

How do you differentiate between a factory refin and an aftermarket one?

Two things, basically. #1 is numbers stamped or etched under the pickguard and on the heel of the neck. #2 is provenance. The burden of proof for a factory refin is on the current owner. If no provenance was handed down, it can't safely be assumed to be a factory job. If no numbers are stamped, it has to be assumed to be non-factory.

Also, since it's sunburst, the only reason to refinish it as sunburst would be finish damage, and Fender stopped spraying nitro in '68. So if the guitar is a '63 and is nitro, they'd have had to ruin the finish within 5years to have a chance at a factory nitro respray. You'd also need the factory job to be during an era when the weren't using paint sticks, and to my knowledge, that wouldn't be from '65-'68.

So basically, I don't think this could possibly be a factory job if it's nitro.

How do you know all this? I can only assume you do this for a living!

This is getting quite basic, now: how can I tell if it's nitro without testing a swatch of the finish?

It does appear to be an older refin. Or perhaps very well aged.

[Embenny]

How do you know all this? I can only assume you do this for a living!

This is getting quite basic, now: how can I tell if it's nitro without testing a swatch of the finish?

It does appear to be an older refin. Or perhaps very well aged.

Hah, you're too kind. I don't do this or a living. I've just spent an unhealthy amount of time reading about vintage Fenders, staring at photos of vintage Fenders, and researching whether guitars had original parts when buying one (or after buying one).

The way you conclusively test for nitro is to wet a Q tip with acetone and gently swab a part of the guitar that isn't seen when assembled. If paint comes off on the Q tip, it's nitro (acetone dissolves nitro and not polyester or polyurethane).

[JSett]

This is getting quite basic, now: how can I tell if it's nitro without testing a swatch of the finish?

It does appear to be an older refin. Or perhaps very well aged.

You cannot conclusively test with just your eyes, although you can make educated guesses. Unless you have the guitar in-hand it's hard to be sure.

As for the refund age, well, there are a lot of clever people out there. Take this 65 Jaguar I bought that the UK dude Rexter refinished and appropriately aged. It was almost indiscernible from an old finish in person...

[lnwt]

That Jag looks so lush

[JSett]

That Jag looks so lush

I was wonderful. I eventually sold it because I had 3 mid-60s Jags and this was my least favourite. It went to another forum member then on again into the unknown.

I'm sure we'll see it again