Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Discussion of vintage Jazzmasters, Jaguars, Bass VIs, Electric XIIs and any other offset-waist instruments.
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akpasta
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Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by akpasta » Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:19 pm

I bought a 1966 Fender Electric XII online and immediately regretted it. This example needed new frets and a new nut right away because all the strings buzzed, either against frets or against each other (nut spacing). Fixing that made the guitar play better unplugged, but through a compression pedal and amp it still it does not sound jangly enough, I use an MXR Dynacomp. I have a Danelectro 12 string for comparison. The Dano sounds better than the Fender and they couldn't be farther apart in cost or quality, the opposite ought to be true!

I had another thread going here that helped answer some questions - http://www.harmonycentral.com/forum/...-jangly-at-all

The next step was to take the guitar back to the repair shop and ask them to test the pickups to make sure everything was okay with the wiring and magnetics, etc. They measured everything and even re-magnetized them. The guy said "this is the way these guitars sound, if you want the sound of a Rick, that's what you should get."

But they DID recommend a novel idea; to change the way each pickup is wired. They are split single coil pickups, meaning technically the bridge pickup is two pickups wired together and the neck pickup is two pickups wired together. I believe over the phone the guy said that each pickup is wired in series, which is what is producing the kind of nasaly, dark, not very jangly tone, whereas if you wire each one in parallel, it will sound more like a real single coil and give a brighter sound.

I'm a bit apprehensive about changing the wiring of this vintage guitar, and haven't given the go-ahead yet. I'm pretty close to selling the guitar so I don't want to kill its value by re-wiring the vintage pickups with some invasive process.

Does anyone have any advice?

Thanks,

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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by zhivago » Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:22 pm

Personally I'd sell the guitar.

They really don't sound like Rics, if that's the exact sound you need.

Aside from actual construction/woods/pickup differences, even the octave strings are positioned the other way around from a Ric 12 string.
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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by akpasta » Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:25 pm

I don't care for the way Rics have the octave strings positioned, I'm mostly concerned about tone. The Fender has a darker, nasaly sound and is not very bright at all. My Danelectro 12 string has a brighter, more ric-like sound, and is a fraction of the price.

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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by zhivago » Thu Jan 04, 2018 12:55 pm

Just keep the Danelectro then and sell the XII.
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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by akpasta » Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:03 pm

I'm getting close to selling the Fender, but I can't really settle for the Danelectro. It sounds great and plays okay, but it just... not very fun to own or look at. It's a $300 guitar at the end of the day. I dunno...

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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by ludobag1 » Thu Jan 04, 2018 2:05 pm

M'y 2 cents a dynacomp is not a jangle box (you have to mode it to made it like a jangle box)
M'y dynacomp is diy and i have mode it to have a jangle box ,for me thé jangle mode is like a treble booster
I Nevers try a Ric 12 ans don t know how it sound ,but if thé xii is not enought jangle ,i think Zhivago advice is a good one sell it before hurt is value

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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by Embenny » Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:20 am

My experience has been that compressors decrease jangle, not the reverse...and yes, the XII is decidedly thicker sounding than a Ric or Danelectro. This sounds like a case of expectations that cannot be met. You can't buy a JM expecting it to quack like a strat, and you can't buy a XII expecting it to jangle like a Ric.

Before you go about rewiring a valuable vintage instrument (at which point it still won't meet your expectations, because a XII in parallel will sound much weaker than intended, and the bridge pickup in particular will probably be shrill beyond usability), I think you should just cash out of your XII experiment and go get yourself a ric.

Or, take that money to any competent custom builder, and have them make a semi-hollow JM or XII-shaped 12-string with Ric pickups in it. Such a build could easily be had for the same (or less) money as you get for your XII, and you can have your Ric tone in an Offset Fender package.

That or, you know, buy a Ric.
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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by Embenny » Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:20 am

My experience has been that compressors decrease jangle, not the reverse...and yes, the XII is decidedly thicker sounding than a Ric or Danelectro. This sounds like a case of expectations that cannot be met. You can't buy a JM expecting it to quack like a strat, and you can't buy a XII expecting it to jangle like a Ric.

Before you go about rewiring a valuable vintage instrument (at which point it still won't meet your expectations, because a XII in parallel will sound much weaker than intended, and the bridge pickup in particular will probably be shrill beyond usability), I think you should just cash out of your XII experiment and go get yourself a ric.

Or, take that money to any competent custom builder, and have them make a semi-hollow JM or XII-shaped 12-string with Ric pickups in it. Such a build could easily be had for the same (or less) money as you get for your XII, and you can have your Ric tone in an Offset Fender package.

That or, you know, buy a Ric.
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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by Singlebladepickup » Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:30 am

you can have your Ric tone in an Offset Fender package
:?

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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by Embenny » Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:39 am

Singlebladepickup wrote:
Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:30 am
you can have your Ric tone in an Offset Fender package
:?
I know, as I was writing that, I was thinking "Damn, why haven't I done this yet?" :D

I love hybrid Offsets...I've done Gretsch/Jag, XII/Jag, Comanche/Mustang, and I'm working on Burns/Marauder, but I haven't done a Ric yet...
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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by matbard » Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:08 am

The original wiring is neck - both pickups in parallel(phase) - bridge - both pickups in parallel(out of phase).

There wasn’t Series option

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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by Embenny » Fri Jan 05, 2018 5:57 pm

matbard wrote:
Fri Jan 05, 2018 9:08 am
The original wiring is neck - both pickups in parallel(phase) - bridge - both pickups in parallel(out of phase).

There wasn’t Series option
No, he means that the halves of each pickup are wired in series, which is correct. As in, bass strings of neck pickup + treble strings of neck pickup being wired in series.

Parallel wiring is an option, but those pickups were not designed around that mode and the tone is a lot thinner.
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Re: Fender Electric XII Pickup Wiring - More Jangle

Post by N0_Camping4U » Sun Jan 07, 2018 3:40 pm

mbene085 wrote:
Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:39 am
Singlebladepickup wrote:
Fri Jan 05, 2018 8:30 am
you can have your Ric tone in an Offset Fender package
:?
I know, as I was writing that, I was thinking "Damn, why haven't I done this yet?" :D

I love hybrid Offsets...I've done Gretsch/Jag, XII/Jag, Comanche/Mustang, and I'm working on Burns/Marauder, but I haven't done a Ric yet...
Whoa, you have pics of these builds? Or a topic?

As to the topic creator: I say sell it since what you want is a Ric it seems. Perhaps sell the Dano and get a Jerry Jones version of your Danolectro since they're very high quality.

I love my XII partscaster, I go raw-dog into my Showman - to me it sounds jangly enough... But I've never been a fan of the Ric's.

Post pictures of your XII!
"I've been waiting for you, Obi-Wan. We meet again, at last. The circle is now complete. When I left you, I was but the learner, now I am the master."

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