Dating an old Jaguar w/ an aftermarket neck

[WillPhistre]

Hey all, guitar noob here. I got an old Jaguar that's pretty beat up — crappy aftermarket neck, body's been spray painted flat black, pickguard is all warped, the upper horn controls don't work at all and the screws that adjust the pickups are stripped. I'm not even sure it's a Fender, honestly — it does have a Fender tremolo, but maybe someone just slapped one on there. I thought I'd ask y'all's opinion just in case it's real. (The pickups do sound amazing so I'm probably gonna keep it)

The tremolo says "Fender Pat. Pending 2,9XX,9XX". All the Fender Dating stuff I find online doesn't go that high. Wanna shed some light on this?




PS. The wiring is all weird too — the first switch on the bottom horn (furthest to the right if you're holding the guitar) is a cutoff, and the tone knob only adjusts the tone on the neck pickup — if you have the bridge pickup turned on by itself, then it acts as a second volume knob for it!? Weird.

[WillPhistre]

No one? Did I post this in the wrong spot?

[andrewaward]

need to post pics, inside and out

[WillPhistre]

Ok I got a bunch of pics, but I can't tell how to post pics here. Do I need to upload them to an image hosting site and post the link here? Is my account too young to post them directly here?

[mcjt]

yes, to an image hosting site.

[WillPhistre]

OK, here we go. Please excuse the cotton balls! http://imgur.com/a/u743A" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

I originally thought that because the neck may not be real, that the back plate wasn't either, but honestly I know nothing about vintage guitars, so I looked up the serial number anyway and it looks like it's from mid-1963 or so. At least, the body is? The neck doesn't have clay dots so it probably isn't original, but could it still be a Fender? The truss nut looks similar and even though it has non-OG string trees, there's still a hole for the original one in roughly the right spot (just guessing here and eyeballing other original Jags from this time).

[WillPhistre]

I should also say that I don't trust myself to take this thing apart — if that's what I gotta do to accurately date it, then I'll probably bring it to someone who knows what they're doing

[zhivago]

I should also say that I don't trust myself to take this thing apart — if that's what I gotta do to accurately date it, then I'll probably bring it to someone who knows what they're doing

It would be real helpful if you could provide some pics with it apart, it is the best way to date things.

From what I see you have an L-series body Jag...the pickguard looks good, tailpiece looks good too...how do you know it is an after-market neck, by the way?

Don't worry too much about taking it apart...my theory is that it is really a machine, made of wood and wires.

Put it this way, if you screw it up and can't put it back together (which really is unlikely), you can take it to whoever you were going to take it to in the first place, to put it back together

[sunburster]

The serial number indicates a '63. The neck looks like an authentic '64-'65 neck -- thin laminate rosewood fingerboard with pearl dot inlays (not clay). It's missing the headstock decal but these tend to flake off old guitars; the headstock shape looks correct to me. The tuners have been replaced, also the string tree has been moved and another installed next to it. If you pop that neck off I bet you find a date stamp on the heel. Next time you change the strings just take them all off, unscrew the neck, and have a peek.

[Axolotl]

Looks great to me.

Regarding the neck, did fender ever used mother of pearl dots in Jags and Jazzies non-bound necks?. Don't remember seeing any, and by 1963 clay dots were still in use. My guess is that the neck could be a vintage Mustang neck, which are unbounded and with pearl dots.

Lovely guitar, grime and all

EDIT: probably not a Mustang neck, the headstock shape doesn't look anything like it.

[PJazzmaster]

Regarding the neck, did fender ever used mother of pearl dots in Jags and Jazzies non-bound necks?

yes! in late '64 / early '65, also on Jags and JM's for a while, before they got bound.
And of course also later on all student models...

Late 64 Jag Neck:

[andrewaward]

It could be the original neck where the clay dots have been replaced at some point with pearl.

As has been said, need to see the neck butt.

Depending on how the original decal was removed it sometimes leaves an imprint, which is readable in certain lights...........you could look for that.
But if the neck date is still present that will tell you exactly what the neck is or isn't.

[PJazzmaster]

It could be the original neck where the clay dots have been replaced at some point with pearl.

not unlikely! As they don't line up well !!! Andrew's theory could be right.


but the side dots do look correct:

[WillPhistre]

Wow, thanks for the response guys!

It could be the original neck where the clay dots have been replaced at some point with pearl.

not unlikely! As they don't line up well !!! Andrew's theory could be right.


but the side dots do look correct:

I don't understand — do the side dots look correct for it being the original neck with replaced dots?

[sookwinder]

did you notice that the neck PUP is either
- in the wrong way around or
- the claw has been removed at some stage and then refitted (soldered back) the wrong way around

also the PUP mounting screw is non original