I am a huge music snob

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DeathJag
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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by DeathJag » Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:06 pm

DesmondWafers wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:34 pm
Yes, here's some advice: Stop taking yourself so seriously and don't judge others for things that are purely subjective. There's a big difference between taking pot shots at John Mayer and claiming that "tastes differ, and that mine are better and more refined than theirs ever will be".
Getting closer, but still accusing and not productive. Kinda like telling a fat person “just don’t eat so much.” Not helpful! But thanks for trying. Enjoy your calm, non-serious and judgement-free life.

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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by DesmondWafers » Tue Sep 18, 2018 5:15 pm

Thank you, I will. Enjoy your judgmental and self-aggrandizing life as well.

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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:56 pm

DeathJag wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:12 am
Shadoweclipse13 wrote:
Mon Sep 17, 2018 10:33 pm
I try not to judge people on musical tastes, as a friend, but where this gets tricky is the dating scene. Most women I know like top 40 hip-hop /R&B, which is totally not my thing. It's tough as a single dude who'd like to meet a cool woman, especially when I find out her tastes are terrible. I like road trips, and music is ALWAYS on in my truck, so if our musical tastes don't jive, it will likely be a problem.
Yes, I am so glad you have those kind of thoughts too. The thing I find is, people who don’t have what I’d call “refined” musical taste, can be similar towards other art. People who don’t care about art are not interesting to me. That doesn’t mean I think they’re less human. At all. It just means they might not be friend or relationship material. By “refined” all I mean is not mainstream, no one has to like what I like.
I agree with that being a detriment to a relationship. I could still be friends with someone who's got different musical tastes than me, but as important as music is to me, I like being able to share it with someone I care about (relationship). For some people, sports are in that category (sharing with a loved one), or movies, or hobbies, or working out. For me it's music. I like discussing the things I'm into as well, with anyone, but I'm well-rounded enough that I can chat with anyone about almost anything. It just won't be as passionate from me as music or movies.
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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by wooderson » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:20 pm

I'm happy to find one or two points of overlapping taste - with one woman, we both loved absolutely filthy rap and bonded over singing along to David Banner's "Play" and Khia's "My Neck My Back" on the second date.

I'm fine with my significant not wanting to listen to Marquee Moon or Dopesmoker with me. Rarely does anyone else's music bother me, the only stuff I actively dislike is pop-country and generic hard rock.

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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by wooderson » Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:37 pm

DeathJag wrote:
Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:59 am
Music is obviously, very obviously subjective. When someone says something “sucks,” we all know they’re just saying that they think it sucks. That’s not what I’m talking about. I mean people with no taste, “radio” taste, “top 40” taste, “music for the masses” taste, “highly compressed” taste, “sounds like all the other shit” taste, and the incomprehensible “I don’t listen to music” taste.

It’s very simple to me - 99% of that shit sucks. Once in a while an artist will inexplicably rise with an original sound, which is inevitable derivative (that’s not at all necessarily a bad thing!), and spawn copycats that mostly suck.

...

The hardest part for me, is how to react to others who know I play music, talking to me about SHITTY music. I start by just smiling and nodding. Then if they seem to be expecting a reaction, I might say something about how we have different taste, and that I like either noise or beauty and nothing in between. Eventually, if forced, I’ll talk about how I’m not moved by it, or that it’s not my thing. Ultimately I’m trying to tell them that our tastes differ, and that mine are better and more refined than theirs ever will be. Sigh. Which is not a productive message.
To the first part - you could expand that to "99% of everything" sucks, whether radio-friendly and popular or horribly obscure. Making art is hard. The key is being open to that 1% without disregarding something because it's not supposed to be good, because it's a genre you don't like, whatever.

To the second part - yeah, that makes you sound like kind of a jerk. You don't want to interact because you're judging their taste. Ask why they like that music, what value they see in it, try to get your mind around what they feel. If nothing else, just be happy that they're happy.

Part of being informed and knowledgable about art is knowing how to assess the things you don't like or what succeeds on its own merits.

Expanding that to jam bands, I listened to a podcast with Nels Cline recently, they detoured into the jam band scene for a minute and the host made a point about how in the jam band scene they're more indifferent to coolness - you can be old, fat and ugly and still get on stage at the festivals and fans will love you. I still don't want to listen to Widespread Panic but I can get down with that POV.

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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by andy_tchp » Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:26 pm

andy wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:53 pm
Anyone ever listen to Guns n Roses?
I know David is a big fan and enjoys the discussion when they're brought up here every month or so.


They suck about as much as Morrissey (lots), maybe a bit more.
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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by oid » Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:41 pm

shadowplay wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 2:42 am
I mean why put yourself through that, I've barely got the time to listen to the stuff i like without trying to find something in stuff I hate.
To grow as a person? To understand people better? To understand yourself better? One thing I learned long ago is that it is easier and quicker to find things worthwhile in what you dislike than it is to defend an opinion.
DeathJag wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 9:12 am
The answer is in the thread title, what would you do instead?
I do not know what to tell you, I gave you one way along with three quotes which each offered another of their own, did you read past the first sentence? If so did you comprehend?
DeathJag wrote:
Mon Sep 17, 2018 6:59 am
The hardest part for me, is how to react to others who know I play music, talking to me about SHITTY music. I start by just smiling and nodding. Then if they seem to be expecting a reaction, I might say something about how we have different taste, and that I like either noise or beauty and nothing in between. Eventually, if forced, I’ll talk about how I’m not moved by it, or that it’s not my thing. Ultimately I’m trying to tell them that our tastes differ, and that mine are better and more refined than theirs ever will be. Sigh. Which is not a productive message.
In my experience most people are quite communicative and will to discuss such things if you put in the effort to figure out WHY. If you just say "it did not move me" or placate them you leave little room for discussion, if you stop and think for a moment and form a well thought out statement explaining why it did not move you or what you did not like about it and ask them what it is they like about it, you are likely to get get a thoughtful response in return. You are only going to get out what you put it in, whether it is music or relationships or anything else.
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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by Shadoweclipse13 » Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:48 pm

oid wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:41 pm
To grow as a person? To understand people better? To understand yourself better?
This is kinda how I feel about people. I feel like I am most transparent when viewed through my musical tastes, and I kinda see most people that way. Not in the "you're a good or bad person" way, but that music represents people in a way that is simple and deep at the same time. If I go on a date, and she wants to hang out again, I usually make a mix for her of stuff I like that I think she might like.

FYI, I make awesome mixes ;D
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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by oid » Wed Sep 19, 2018 1:10 am

I suppose this should go here.
Analyze Phish

As far as I can tell you have to either hate or love Phish to enjoy this, those rare few in the middle seem unimpressed in my experience, both extremes seem to love it.
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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by shadowplay » Wed Sep 19, 2018 1:44 am

andy_tchp wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 11:26 pm
andy wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:53 pm
Anyone ever listen to Guns n Roses?
I know David is a big fan and enjoys the discussion when they're brought up here every month or so.


They suck about as much as Morrissey (lots), maybe a bit more.
It's been a month or two since OSG broke out the chaps and cycling shorts and declared it's largely USA based love for Guns N Roses. There have been so many GnR threads that they probably deserve their own sub forum only accessible through an animated star spangled banner gif.

Btw and very OT but given your location and I guess your sig you no doubt are up on this but most folk I know with a fondness for Go Betweens are very keen on The Goon Sax.

D
Are you loathsome tonight?

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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by MattK » Wed Sep 19, 2018 3:46 am

I own and wear this t shirt regularly
Image

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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by panoramic » Wed Sep 19, 2018 4:28 am

DesmondWafers wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:34 pm
Yes, here's some advice: Stop taking yourself so seriously and don't judge others for things that are purely subjective. There's a big difference between taking pot shots at John Mayer and claiming that "tastes differ, and that mine are better and more refined than theirs ever will be".
where's the fun in that though?
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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by Jaguar018 » Wed Sep 19, 2018 6:54 am

andy wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 4:53 pm
Or the Beetles?
That band really bugs me. :jacked:

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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by DeathJag » Wed Sep 19, 2018 9:50 am

MatthewK wrote:
Wed Sep 19, 2018 3:46 am
I own and wear this t shirt regularly
Image
Yes!
wooderson wrote:
Tue Sep 18, 2018 10:37 pm
To the first part - you could expand that to "99% of everything" sucks, whether radio-friendly and popular or horribly obscure. Making art is hard. The key is being open to that 1% without disregarding something because it's not supposed to be good, because it's a genre you don't like, whatever.

To the second part - yeah, that makes you sound like kind of a jerk. You don't want to interact because you're judging their taste. Ask why they like that music, what value they see in it, try to get your mind around what they feel. If nothing else, just be happy that they're happy.

Part of being informed and knowledgable about art is knowing how to assess the things you don't like or what succeeds on its own merits.

Expanding that to jam bands, I listened to a podcast with Nels Cline recently, they detoured into the jam band scene for a minute and the host made a point about how in the jam band scene they're more indifferent to coolness - you can be old, fat and ugly and still get on stage at the festivals and fans will love you. I still don't want to listen to Widespread Panic but I can get down with that POV.
That is some good words. Man, I could take many lessons from that. I like what you said about art, but man does one need to hear a thousand versions of Beyoncé to appreciate the elements separately? It all sounds like Brittany Spears to me heh.

With people who I otherwise respect (it’s a small number), I have actually done what you and Oid suggest, finding out what they like about it and discussing merits irrespective of context. But I still hate the music and have a hard time concealing the disdain.

It’s so hard to just be happy that they’re happy! I want to enrich and enlighten! For example, in 2007 I worked with Jim Gandolfini. He loved Green Day, so much that he’d blast Dookie in his trailer to get hyped for a scene, air guitar and everything! So we talked about it and it turned out he’d never heard Screeching Weasel / Queers / Lillingtons / Manges, etc. So I made him a mixtape CD... and he kept listening to Green Day. I asked him about it a few weeks later and he hadn’t listened to it. He probably lost it.

My takeaway is that he had a special place for that album, and didn’t love the genre enough to explore new bands. Or just didn’t have the time then. Internally I found it impossible to respect, but I do acknowledge that it worked for him and that was great. I’d like to think that years later he found that disc and had his world rocked. (I made a noise mixtape for Justin Timberlake because he’d never heard that shit, Lasse Marhaug and Merzbow. He probably lost it too.)

I mean, I’m open to new music, very much so. I will happily listen to just about anything once, or at least the first twenty or thirty seconds of anything. I can usually tell right away if I like it or don’t. The issue is when people really want you to like something, because they love it. Or vice versa.

One thing which is kinda fascinating about this topic, is how the discourse leads to some instant personality and lifestyle topics. For example, I am historically a reactive person, which I don’t like and am taking steps to change. This means I’m way too focused on my triggers than the music. And everything is black and white.

Man I loved Appetite For Destruction when it came out...

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Re: I am a huge music snob

Post by panoramic » Wed Sep 19, 2018 10:04 am

i think it's comical how much opposition you met on a forum populated by music snobbies or reformed ones. Pretty much everyone here think they're an expert on something or other. Music though, still pretty sure you don't have anything on my level of asshat
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