Fender Electric XII Distortion - Compression issue?

[akpasta]

Hi Folks,

I have been playing a Danelectro 12 string through a reissue MXR Dynacomp into a variety of amps from Twins, Deluxes, and even Orange and JC-120s, getting amazing Byrds jangle. Not super stoked on the toy-guitar quality of the Dano I bought a beautiful 66' Fender Electric XII, which feels AMAZING, but I am having a really hard time getting a clean, compressed tone out of it. I understand it will never chime exactly like a Ric, but I can't get anything NEAR that sound, and it's quite frustrating.

When I plug the guitar straight into a Twin Reverb, JC-120, or any amp, it's fairly clean. However, when I run it through my reissue MXR DynaComp it becomes distorted and crunchy. I have been careful to ensure I am not driving the pedal louder than the amp of course, which produces distortion on any guitar.

Like I said, I have been using this DynaComp on a Danelectro 12 string and it makes the Byrds jangle perfectly, but for some reason with the Electric XII it produces a crunchy, distorted sound.

At first I thought it might be the pickups, as the guitar is also a little nasaly in general. Curtis Novak says that the low-output, tightly wound stock XII pickups can get distorted and nasaly, and sells a lighter wound FAT version replacement that he says will boost the trebles and lows and scoop the mid a bit, and provide more output which will take care of the distortion. I'd like to avoid altering the vintage electronics if I can though.

Could it be the dynacomp is causing the distortion? Should I try a different compressor? Would a MXR M76 Studio Compressor pedal, with more controls help lessen the distortion? http://tonereport.com/reviews/mxr-m76-studio-compressor

Thanks for the advice.

[akpasta]

I tried the janglebox pedal last night, which sounds like a light compression pedal, but most importantly it has a switch that adjusts high-cuts, from "dark" "normal" and "bright" (no high's removed). The janglebox on the "bright" setting is making the guitar sound the best that it ever has; I was able to get some bright, jangly highs without the guitar becoming broken up or distorted. I was switching back and forth form the Janglebox to the Dynacomp to figure out why, and a little experimentation has revealed that the distortion I was hearing with the Dynacomp was coming from adding highs and cutting lows and mids from the amp, after the compression stage, and also the Dynacomp compresses a lot more. For some reason those drastic EQ changes on the amp, after compression seems to distort the sound, but I don't understand why.

It's still a pretty warm sound (I want bright and clean). I would like to find a way to shape the sound more before the amp without distorting. I don't think there are any other compressors that give EQ controls like the Janglebox, so I suppose I will stick with that. I have read that the Snarling Dog Very Tone pedal is useful because, unlike a basic EQ pedal, it has a pre-amp that actually produces sound, instead of just altering signal.

Also, I am wondering if Curtis Novak's replacement XII pickups would help. Does anyone else have any experience with these?

Thanks.

[marqueemoon]

I think you're on the right track, but I have a 66 XII too and it's just an inherently more throaty sounding guitar than a lot of 12 strings.

Between the cost of pickups and potential depreciation from messing with the guitar it doesn't seem worth it.

It also depends on how you're using the guitar. If it's for recording why not just take it direct and try various plugins and amp sims until you find a sound that works? This could also help you zero in on the type of compression/eq you'll need to make it work with a real amp.

[akpasta]

Thank you. I agree I am on the right rack and I AM apprehensive about changing the vintage instrument (although hell I've already had to re-fret and replace the nut).

Do you have any suggestions on ways to add highs and subtract mids without getting distortion? I think the JangleBox is good for compression, EQ is the next hurdle.

[marqueemoon]

Thank you. I agree I am on the right rack and I AM apprehensive about changing the vintage instrument (although hell I've already had to re-fret and replace the nut).

Do you have any suggestions on ways to add highs and subtract mids without getting distortion? I think the JangleBox is good for compression, EQ is the next hurdle.

Before you start looking at separate pedals for eq and compression look at a few that offer parallel compression (blend of compressed and uncompressed signal) and some basic tone shaping. The Wampler Ego and Greer Lamplighter both have this. The (compact) Barber Tone Press has a bright switch as does the Mini Ego. There may be others. To me being able to blend in some uncompressed signal helps things sound more natural at squishier settings.

If you need more tone shaping I'd say a high quality parametric EQ so you can really focus on the problem frequencies.

The classic trick for finding/correcting problem frequencies with software parametric eq is to start with a fairly narrow q and a big boost and sweep around the frequency range until it sounds the ugliest, then switch from boosting to cutting the ugly frequency, adjusting the amount of cut and q until it sounds natural.

Then if you end up getting an eq pedal you'll know what to look for in terms of the frequencies it needs to be able to zero in on.

[akpasta]

Thank you. I agree I am on the right rack and I AM apprehensive about changing the vintage instrument (although hell I've already had to re-fret and replace the nut).

Do you have any suggestions on ways to add highs and subtract mids without getting distortion? I think the JangleBox is good for compression, EQ is the next hurdle.

Before you start looking at separate pedals for eq and compression look at a few that offer parallel compression (blend of compressed and uncompressed signal) and some basic tone shaping. The Wampler Ego and Greer Lamplighter both have this. The (compact) Barber Tone Press has a bright switch as does the Mini Ego. There may be others. To me being able to blend in some uncompressed signal helps things sound more natural at squishier settings.

If you need more tone shaping I'd say a high quality parametric EQ so you can really focus on the problem frequencies.

The classic trick for finding/correcting problem frequencies with software parametric eq is to start with a fairly narrow q and a big boost and sweep around the frequency range until it sounds the ugliest, then switch from boosting to cutting the ugly frequency, adjusting the amount of cut and q until it sounds natural.

Then if you end up getting an eq pedal you'll know what to look for in terms of the frequencies it needs to be able to zero in on.

That is very very helpful. I don't have a parametric on anything, but I do have one on a 4-track and i suppose I could try that.

I know that the 7 band doesn't seem to be enough to get that mid nasaly sound out of there, but I'll try more things I s'pose.

Good rec on the blending compressed and uncompressed, I'll take a look at that when looking at more compression pedals as well.