Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

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Larsongs
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Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by Larsongs » Sun Jul 12, 2020 9:48 am

Here's a Link. Is it really that hard to hear a difference? To me the Vintage was obvious & sounds better by far...

What do you think?

https://youtu.be/cUVq5-pqZZ0

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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by SadFuzz » Sun Jul 12, 2020 2:38 pm

I personally picked B but i'm not a deluxe fan so eh. They both sounded like a guitar and both work as a means to amplify the guitar's signal just with different characteristics, which could probs be eq'd out.
I prefer vintage gear myself, i just think that the vintage vs reissue misses the point. If fender were to make a deluxe reverb to be the exact same as a 60s model they would be completely out of the price range of normal players. The reissue allows people to get some of the amps flavour without burning a £2000 hole in their pocket. Either being a better amp is completely subjective to your budget and what you want from an amp.
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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by Larsongs » Sun Jul 12, 2020 6:10 pm

I guess it's subjective.. Different strokes....

Fender does make new Amp called the Vintage 64 Deluxe Reverb.. $2499.00. I haven't played one so I can't say how it sounds. It better be great as it's competing with real Vintage DR's of that era..

To me the new DRRI's sound harsh in the higher Frequencies.. I own one.. It's pretty good for the Price point. Still, There is no EQ adjustment to make it sound as good as my friends Vintage 65 or many others I have played...

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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by marqueemoon » Sun Jul 12, 2020 6:43 pm

So many variables though. With old amps a lot comes down to how they are maintained.

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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by Embenny » Sun Jul 12, 2020 7:09 pm

Literally 30 seconds listening to that on a phone and I could tell the two amps weren't even set at the same volume or mixed to be presented as such.

I mean, positioning the mic slightly differently on the two amps could yield a huge and artificial difference.

Running both amps through the same cabinet with the mic in the same position would be a more honest comparison and eliminate factors like speaker break-in. The new amp may never have been played at sufficiently high volume to even break in its speaker (it was listed as a 2017 model and this was recorded in 2018).

Vintage amps can have anything in them form an original speaker to a reconed one to something brand new, so eliminating speakers and mic positioning as a variable just makes sense to me.
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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by andy_tchp » Sun Jul 12, 2020 8:47 pm

Yes, amp 'B' is definitely louder. I got bored of the blooz noodling and switched off, is that what was being 'tested'?
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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by SadFuzz » Sun Jul 12, 2020 11:33 pm

andy_tchp wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 8:47 pm
Yes, amp 'B' is definitely louder. I got bored of the blooz noodling and switched off, is that what was being 'tested'?
B was louder and i also heard more low end and mids so i felt it sounded better, assuming it to be the vintage model.
After listening to that i'd still take my hybrid peavey over a deluxe.
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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by ElephantDNA » Tue Jul 14, 2020 3:26 pm

The problem is which vintage? Different years, different components, differing amount of wear...it's going to vary a lot. If you're touring or playing a lot of shows, I would definitely go with the reissues even if it's a small cost to the sound. If you're just recording, you really have to play these amps to get a feel, but if you can get a good deal online and just hope it sounds good that's fine too. Sometimes it works out :)

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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by jvin248 » Tue Jul 14, 2020 4:13 pm

.

Ugh. I'm not a fan of that channel. No play click for me.

Here's a different amp and comparison if you want to test the ears

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EX9su1L-JAE

Or this one between a tube amp and pedal

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UwoTIRPkfhE

.

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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by Larsongs » Thu Jul 16, 2020 5:43 am

ElephantDNA wrote:
Tue Jul 14, 2020 3:26 pm
The problem is which vintage? Different years, different components, differing amount of wear...it's going to vary a lot. If you're touring or playing a lot of shows, I would definitely go with the reissues even if it's a small cost to the sound. If you're just recording, you really have to play these amps to get a feel, but if you can get a good deal online and just hope it sounds good that's fine too. Sometimes it works out :)
I have a friend who has about 20 Vintage Fender Amps from early Champs to 60's Super Reverbs. Plus, most Fender Amp models between those 2. All are like Mint..

After playing his Amps I can barely stand playing my modern Reissue Fender Amps.. The difference to my Ears is huge.. The modern RI's just don't sound anywhere near as good...

I wish Fender could recreate those Vintage Sounds in their modern Amps.

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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by 46346 » Mon Jul 20, 2020 4:38 am

there are so many variables.

do you bring your DR to his place to compare? sometimes the sound of another room can make a huge difference.

many of the DRRI's suffer from lousy factory speakers. when that's the case, an upgrade can work wonders.


if a reissue is hand-built with the best components, you can get there.
professional sound has always been costly. but there are some used bargains to be had.
i've been using newer hand built amps from Vox, Victoria (tweed Fender style), and 3 Monkeys,
i bought them gently used for half of the new price. and the quality is obvious.

i would think some of those hand-wired tweed Fenders from recent years oughtta be good. i think they may be Custom Shop amps.
i wonder how they do on the used market, now that they've been out for a while. i've not spent any quality time with one yet.

that said, i tend to enjoy vintage amps even more, there's often some cool vibes and fun history,
i've ended up with some amazing oddballs, rare transitional models, and the occasional near holy grail dream amp for a few hundred bucks.
you just gotta put in that extra labor to keep them reasonably fresh.

anytime someone brings a vintage amp to my studio, or drags one up on stage, i get excited and gotta check it out.
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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by Larsongs » Tue Jul 21, 2020 10:02 am

46346 wrote:
Mon Jul 20, 2020 4:38 am
there are so many variables.

do you bring your DR to his place to compare? sometimes the sound of another room can make a huge difference.

many of the DRRI's suffer from lousy factory speakers. when that's the case, an upgrade can work wonders.


if a reissue is hand-built with the best components, you can get there.
professional sound has always been costly. but there are some used bargains to be had.
i've been using newer hand built amps from Vox, Victoria (tweed Fender style), and 3 Monkeys,
i bought them gently used for half of the new price. and the quality is obvious.

i would think some of those hand-wired tweed Fenders from recent years oughtta be good. i think they may be Custom Shop amps.
i wonder how they do on the used market, now that they've been out for a while. i've not spent any quality time with one yet.

that said, i tend to enjoy vintage amps even more, there's often some cool vibes and fun history,
i've ended up with some amazing oddballs, rare transitional models, and the occasional near holy grail dream amp for a few hundred bucks.
you just gotta put in that extra labor to keep them reasonably fresh.

anytime someone brings a vintage amp to my studio, or drags one up on stage, i get excited and gotta check it out.
I took my 65 DRRI once to his Jam Sessions.. I was embarrassed.. Not because it wasn't vintage. But, because the Sound was harsh & didn't blend with his Vintage Amps the other Guys were playing... I left it Home after that....

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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by 46346 » Tue Jul 21, 2020 10:36 pm

aw, bummer! those guys have probably been spending years and years checking out amps.

what speaker do you have in your DRRI? i don't have one myself, but when i was doing traveling gigs, i often specified that amp on a typical club gig rider, as it was similar in volume to my '66 Ampeg Reverberocket, and was easily found in most cities.
yeah, i think i know what you mean by harsh. it was just fine for my stage shows, but there has been quite a cult of guys and gals upgrading the speaker and i did notice some improvements - about 1 out of 5 rental or borrowed DRRI's had the speaker changed.
it's been a few years since, so i don't really know what the standard issue speaker is these days.

the good news for you, as i remember you mentioned on another thread - you have a good amp tech!
go ahead and play your buddies amps, and ask them to help you find one!
your tech can make it shine!

i love checking out cool old amps, and the next best thing to getting another one for myself, is helping someone else with a great score.
this happens a lot - i may see something amazing on craigslist or ebay or reverb.com, but i'm cash poor, or just out of room for another amp...
challenge your jam-mates to help you find a vintage wonder. it sounds like you know what you like when you hear it, so it's just a matter of patience in finding one!

cheers,
eric
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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by adamrobertt » Sun Jul 26, 2020 5:08 am

Larsongs wrote:
Sun Jul 12, 2020 6:10 pm
I guess it's subjective.. Different strokes....

Fender does make new Amp called the Vintage 64 Deluxe Reverb.. $2499.00. I haven't played one so I can't say how it sounds. It better be great as it's competing with real Vintage DR's of that era..

To me the new DRRI's sound harsh in the higher Frequencies.. I own one.. It's pretty good for the Price point. Still, There is no EQ adjustment to make it sound as good as my friends Vintage 65 or many others I have played...
It's the speaker. The ones that Fender puts in the new reissues is pretty harsh. I have a Cannabis Rex in mine and it sounds fantastic.

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Re: Vintage vs Reissue Amps - is it that hard to Hear?

Post by jdr1014 » Sun Jul 26, 2020 5:14 am

I currently have both vintage and reissue DR's .......... and have had other examples of both in the past. IME the difference is slight - once both are equipped with (or played through) the same/similar speaker (I use Weber 12F150)........... and .......... both amps have same setup, meaning tube compliment, bias setting, etc. The difference between a well set up/ broken in original and a poorly set up new Reissue can be quite significant. The reverse can be true as well, just as there can be a lot of difference in two seemingly identical BR or SF originals.

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