Sort of NAD: '65 Princeton Non Reverb

[rbrcbr]

Well guys, as part of our move to NYC, I sold my Super Reverb plus a couple random things to GC and managed to get enough credit on account to snag this amp.



Aside from the crappy Radioshack Realistic speaker, it appeared to be all original (haven't had it opened up yet) so at $999, I jumped on it. We just got to Brooklyn on Friday and found out that it had shipped and was ready for pickup today.






Went to unbox it at GC and while it was nicely wrapped packed with bubble wrap, the speaker was ripped out of the baffle at some point during the shipment. Like it was laid out in the cabinet and there are wood bits everywhere. So that sort of sucks. Also turns out the gem light is out. The manager there told me to get in touch with the store I bought it from (due to the way it was processed/ordered) and they'll get me some sort of refund if I want to keep it. Will call tomorrow to see what can be done.





You can also see that a little key ring was used to secure the speaker to a screw sticking out of the baffle, definitely a home rigged thing.


It's a shame as it's a nice enough amp, just needs some TLC to be in tip top. The power tubes were taken out and wrapped in bubble wrap, so I plugged them in and it fired right up and sounded decent. It's got some mismatched old stock tubes, RCA 12ax7s, RCA and GE 6v6s, and a GZ34 that I couldn't ID. It sounds fairly weak and is super quiet at 10 - I'm guessing from the likely suuuuper inefficient Radioshack speaker in there. Treble knob pot could use some cleaner but aside from that everything else seems intact. I'm sure it would sound much better with a proper speaker and cleaning.

Any suggestions regarding replacing the baffle? I was considering putting a 12" speaker in it already so maybe this is a sign to do so just to get that out of the way up front. I've heard a new baffle will likely be higher quality than whatever flimsy baffle Fender put in there. Also, any suggestions on speakers? Hoping to get this thing up and running properly soon.

[wproffitt]

Congrats! I think you’ll have a great time with this amp once it’s sorted out. Replacing the baffle in a BF model should be relatively simple as it was only later that they built them into the cab. A friend of mine has a BFPR with a 12” speaker (non-original, obviously) and it sounds great! As for speaker choice, I’m loving the Weber I have I the Tremolux I built a couple of years back, but I’m sure others will be along with recommendations. I like the Oxford 10” in my SFPR, but that’s a 10” and a slightly different amp.

[tdbajus]

You know what? Having the baffle fall apart during shipping might have been a blessing in disguise.

I replaced the baffle in my Deluxe after it literally fell out of my amp, and as you might imagine, replacing it with a new, non-particle board Mojo baffle made a beloved amp even more beloved.

Have GC knock $250 off the price of the amp.

Some people would replace it with a 12" baffle, but I am so in love with about 5 different 10" speakers right now, I'd stick with the 10".

BTW- you might want to reduce the negative feedback on the amp, too.

[andy_tchp]

I too would stick with the 10". There's something about them with a Princeton that's just so right.

In good operating health[*] and with a proper speaker that amp will be downright magical. There's something really special about the clean sounds the Non-Reverb gets, if I could only have the choice of one amp for recording it'd be my ex-guitarist's early '70s Princeton.

Depending on what you're looking for I can give a shout for the Weber 10F150T, I use one in a (dead on clone of a) BF Princeton Reverb. It's a BIG, loud, round, great sounding speaker. Paired with the NR Princeton circuit you'll have a 'mini Twin' (but it'll sound better and hurt your back/shoulders much less ) There are other less efficient speaker options around if you want less overall volume, but these amps don't tend to break up until the far end of the volume dial anyway.


[*]Don't be conned into replacing those 'mismatched old tubes' unless they're actually failing.

[wproffitt]

I just looked up the Weber 10f150 that Andy recommenced and it’s meant to replicate the magic of the Oxford ceramic speakers commonly found in these old amps. If it sounds anywhere near as good as the Oxford in my SFPR, you’ve got a strong contender!

[rbrcbr]

Congrats! I think you’ll have a great time with this amp once it’s sorted out. Replacing the baffle in a BF model should be relatively simple as it was only later that they built them into the cab. A friend of mine has a BFPR with a 12” speaker (non-original, obviously) and it sounds great! As for speaker choice, I’m loving the Weber I have I the Tremolux I built a couple of years back, but I’m sure others will be along with recommendations. I like the Oxford 10” in my SFPR, but that’s a 10” and a slightly different amp.

Cool, yeah I noticed the screws inside that make it easy to swap. Thanks for the input! Weber is definitely a consideration. Can't wait to get this thing in tip top shape.

You know what? Having the baffle fall apart during shipping might have been a blessing in disguise.

I replaced the baffle in my Deluxe after it literally fell out of my amp, and as you might imagine, replacing it with a new, non-particle board Mojo baffle made a beloved amp even more beloved.

Have GC knock $250 off the price of the amp.

Some people would replace it with a 12" baffle, but I am so in love with about 5 different 10" speakers right now, I'd stick with the 10".

BTW- you might want to reduce the negative feedback on the amp, too.

I was thinking this myself, that it was a blessing in disguise. Did you notice the replacement baffle change the sonic character at all? I'm assuming solid wood vs shitty particle board?

Also, what does reducing the negative feedback do?

GC refunded me $300, which feels like I'm coming out on top for sure. I suppose I'll use the money to replace the baffle, get it looked over, convert to a 3 prong power cord, and hopefully have enough for the speaker. I was looking at something like a 12" Celestion Alnico Cream (highly regarded by a friend of mine), but one of those runs $300 on its own.

I want to be able to gig with it, and really only care about getting clean tones with it cranked up. Dirt I'll reserve for pedals. From what I can tell, a 12" would get me more volume for gigging and better bass response, but people say it takes away some of the "sweet" sonic character of the Princeton. So I'm torn between 10" and 12".

I too would stick with the 10". There's something about them with a Princeton that's just so right.

In good operating health[*] and with a proper speaker that amp will be downright magical. There's something really special about the clean sounds the Non-Reverb gets, if I could only have the choice of one amp for recording it'd be my ex-guitarist's early '70s Princeton.

Depending on what you're looking for I can give a shout for the Weber 10F150T, I use one in a (dead on clone of a) BF Princeton Reverb. It's a BIG, loud, round, great sounding speaker. Paired with the NR Princeton circuit you'll have a 'mini Twin' (but it'll sound better and hurt your back/shoulders much less ) There are other less efficient speaker options around if you want less overall volume, but these amps don't tend to break up until the far end of the volume dial anyway.


[*]Don't be conned into replacing those 'mismatched old tubes' unless they're actually failing.

It doesn't help that the Weber you suggested is $100, vs $300 for the Celestion. I've heard great things about that speaker but again, the toss up between 10" and 12". I guess ultimately I could get one of each baffle and swap when need be, just more money than I want to spend. I know the speaker (regardless) will make a huge difference compared to the one in there currently. Definitely want something more efficient in there for the clean tones. I'll take another look at the Weber and see what I can find.

And no, those tubes aren't going anywhere - failing or not. I'll hang onto them either way.

[andy_tchp]

FWIW my mate gigged with his in our very noisy 5-piece with a regular old Jensen reissue 10" and had headroom to spare. The 10F150T is more efficient again.

For what they are those things are super loud - his stayed clean pretty much right up to 10 on the volume control and didn't have any of the low-end flub that can afflict the Reverb models when they're turned up.

[Gavanti]

Another good option is a Jupiter 10”. I have a Jupiter 10lc in my ‘70 SFPNR, and like it a good bit. There are a few reviews around in different fora discussing these. I believe they’re made by WGS for Jupiter. It makes for a pretty strident and stout tone when the amp is pushed. It sounds like some folks preferred the 10sc, a smaller wattage, less efficient version for quieter applications. There’s a comparison of the two speakers on YT, but to my ear it’s more representative of the cabinet and mic conditions than the speakers.

[Larsongs]

I'd bet the Weber (Oxford Clone) will give you more Clean than the Celestion Cream.. Celestion Greenback (12") will give you more clean...

I have a '65 PRRI which sounds great as is. But, now I'm curious about how that Weber 10F150T would sound....

Congrats on getting that Amp. Once you get it sorted it should be great! I agree about not being hasty about replacing those existing Tubes unless they are worn out.

[StevenO]

Awesome find! I'd love one of these.

[marqueemoon]

Very, very nice.

[rbrcbr]

Thanks everyone! Got to play a '67 Princeton with a 12" speaker at Southside Guitars today (along with a '67 Guild Starfire iv and '59 Jazzmaster ) and it sounded heavenly. Might be convinced to just go with a 12", but the question is which.

Dropped it off for the 3 prong cable conversion and a once over by the tech today, should have it back in a week or so. It looks like Mojotone is the only option for the baffle replacement but they seem to take a while - does anyone have experience dealing with them? Also, the tech was explaining to me that swapping the original grille cloth is super time consuming and sort of difficult along with needing a staple gun...so does anyone have experience aging a new grille cloth for a vintage amp? Or any suggestions on how to make the swap easier?

[tdbajus]

I didn't find it hard at all to put the old grill cloth on my new Mojo baffle- it was sort of frozen in place and popped right on like a hat.

[beauzooka]

I’ll recommend the 10” Eminence Ramrod speaker. It sounds loud, clean and huge for it’s size. I have it in a late 70’s Princeton non-reverb.