TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
- Guitarman555
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:36 pm
TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Hi everybody,
I have bought TV front Deluxe. Sounds cool, is very loud, distorts almost at starting volumes, as it is expected from those early tweed Fenders. Problem is that after 20 minutes it starts to lose sustain! Every note just dies very quickly. This appears 20 minutes after I turn the amp on and when it gets warm. What can be the problem? Tubes, or old caps (some caps are original, some are changed)
Thanks a lot!
I have bought TV front Deluxe. Sounds cool, is very loud, distorts almost at starting volumes, as it is expected from those early tweed Fenders. Problem is that after 20 minutes it starts to lose sustain! Every note just dies very quickly. This appears 20 minutes after I turn the amp on and when it gets warm. What can be the problem? Tubes, or old caps (some caps are original, some are changed)
Thanks a lot!
- Embenny
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 10363
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 5:07 am
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Get thee to a tech!Guitarman555 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 30, 2018 12:20 pmHi everybody,
I have bought TV front Deluxe. Sounds cool, is very loud, distorts almost at starting volumes, as it is expected from those early tweed Fenders. Problem is that after 20 minutes it starts to lose sustain! Every note just dies very quickly. This appears 20 minutes after I turn the amp on and when it gets warm. What can be the problem? Tubes, or old caps (some caps are original, some are changed)
Thanks a lot!
Seriously, I wouldn't even test a 68 year-old amp with 68 year-old caps beyond checking if it turns on. Is it still 2-prong? I wouldn't chance playing through it until it got a thorough checkup.
But, to answer your question, yes - tubes and caps could both cause this, and they are both easily checked out by someone with the right equipment and knowledge.
The artist formerly known as mbene085.
- Guitarman555
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:36 pm
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Yes it is still 2 prong, but I don t think I shoud change it to 3 prong. I am also thinking that maybe it is only an old resistor.. Which should be easy to change..
- Jaguar018
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 8051
- Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2008 6:48 am
- Location: Burbs of Washington DC
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Why don't you want to change it to three prong?Guitarman555 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 30, 2018 12:51 pmYes it is still 2 prong, but I don t think I shoud change it to 3 prong. I am also thinking that maybe it is only an old resistor.. Which should be easy to change..
- Guitarman555
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:36 pm
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Well, I am not sure where I would connect the third prong in the amp..Jaguar018 wrote: ↑Fri Feb 02, 2018 6:51 amWhy don't you want to change it to three prong?Guitarman555 wrote: ↑Tue Jan 30, 2018 12:51 pmYes it is still 2 prong, but I don t think I shoud change it to 3 prong. I am also thinking that maybe it is only an old resistor.. Which should be easy to change..
- Guitarman555
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:36 pm
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Anybody any advice on the loss of sustain problem? I have an impression that it could be a tired resitor, when it heats up, it just changes its quality.. What do you think?
- Embenny
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 10363
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 5:07 am
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Here you go.Guitarman555 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:17 pmWell, I am not sure where I would connect the third prong in the amp..
Truly, take it to a good tech. Diagnosing that kind of amp problem online is like diagnosing a medical condition online. It's just not going to work.Guitarman555 wrote: ↑Sun Feb 04, 2018 3:18 pmAnybody any advice on the loss of sustain problem? I have an impression that it could be a tired resitor, when it heats up, it just changes its quality.. What do you think?
The artist formerly known as mbene085.
- Jaguar018
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 8051
- Joined: Thu Nov 06, 2008 6:48 am
- Location: Burbs of Washington DC
- Embenny
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 10363
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 5:07 am
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Still better than my impotent Bassman.
It works just fine at home, but whenever I try to play with it in front of anyone else - nothing.
I think it's just performance anxiety, but my bandmates want met to get it checked out...
The artist formerly known as mbene085.
- Guitarman555
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:36 pm
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Thanks for jokes, guys. Surely I will take it to the doctor, but anyway, I would like to know your opinion, what it can be, if you have had the problem with the sustain, after the amp warms up (after 20 mins playing)
- Embenny
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 10363
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 5:07 am
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Joking aside, my best bets are tubes or electrolytic caps. I've seen all sorts of weird symptoms from old electrolytics, and by old, I mean ones that were 30 years younger than the ones in your amp.Guitarman555 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:57 amThanks for jokes, guys. Surely I will take it to the doctor, but anyway, I would like to know your opinion, what it can be, if you have had the problem with the sustain, after the amp warms up (after 20 mins playing)
Tubes are also an easy thing to test.
After those two, you're into weirder, less common issues.
The artist formerly known as mbene085.
- Guitarman555
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:36 pm
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Thanks a lot for quick answer, ok I will test tubes first, unfortunately I have in disposal only the rectifier 5Y3GT, two 6v6 tubex but NOT AVAILABLE the preamp tubes which are 6SC7 tubes. Do you know if they are possible to subsitute by Ax7?mbene085 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:32 amJoking aside, my best bets are tubes or electrolytic caps. I've seen all sorts of weird symptoms from old electrolytics, and by old, I mean ones that were 30 years younger than the ones in your amp.Guitarman555 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2018 10:57 amThanks for jokes, guys. Surely I will take it to the doctor, but anyway, I would like to know your opinion, what it can be, if you have had the problem with the sustain, after the amp warms up (after 20 mins playing)
Tubes are also an easy thing to test.
After those two, you're into weirder, less common issues.
- Embenny
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 10363
- Joined: Tue May 24, 2016 5:07 am
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
I have been told it is possible with a socket change. 12AX7 are higher gain. I have heard that 12AY7's are closer to the original tone of your tubes.
There was a Groove Tubes product called the "substi-tube" that let you plug a 9-pin 12A_7 into an 8-pin 6SC7 socket, but all the vendors I checked online say it's out of stock. Not sure if it's still made? If it is, that would be a non-destructive way to try those tubes.
Of course, the simplest way to test a tube is with an actual tube tester - any amp tech should have one, and it should accommodate an octal tube no problem.
There was a Groove Tubes product called the "substi-tube" that let you plug a 9-pin 12A_7 into an 8-pin 6SC7 socket, but all the vendors I checked online say it's out of stock. Not sure if it's still made? If it is, that would be a non-destructive way to try those tubes.
Of course, the simplest way to test a tube is with an actual tube tester - any amp tech should have one, and it should accommodate an octal tube no problem.
The artist formerly known as mbene085.
- Guitarman555
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:36 pm
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Many thanks for reply, first I will check the available amps and we will see. But something is telling me it won´t be amps, I think worn amps have different symptoms. Day after tomorrow I will get to the amp and switchthe amps. Will let you know.mbene085 wrote: ↑Mon Feb 05, 2018 11:51 amI have been told it is possible with a socket change. 12AX7 are higher gain. I have heard that 12AY7's are closer to the original tone of your tubes.
There was a Groove Tubes product called the "substi-tube" that let you plug a 9-pin 12A_7 into an 8-pin 6SC7 socket, but all the vendors I checked online say it's out of stock. Not sure if it's still made? If it is, that would be a non-destructive way to try those tubes.
Of course, the simplest way to test a tube is with an actual tube tester - any amp tech should have one, and it should accommodate an octal tube no problem.
- Guitarman555
- PAT. # 2.972.923
- Posts: 268
- Joined: Sun Jan 14, 2018 2:36 pm
Re: TV front Deluxe from 1950 - loss of sustain
Any other thoughts? Many thanks!